"The outcome of disease always depends both on the virulence of the pathogen and the health of the individual immune system."

Nope. This makes no sense. Lots of people who seemed vibrant will get a very severe case of the same illness that a vulnerable baby overcomes in a day.

And under the germ theory it doesn't matter how strong your immune system *was*. Once it's been overcome by the pathogen it is every bit as weak as anybody else's with that pathogen.

"Why do you think that within a few years (not many) of the introduction of the vaccines for them, pertussis, measles, mumps, rubella, tetanus, diphtheria, Hib disease, and chickenpox (and others) almost entirely disappeared?"

Why do you keep asking this question when I've already provided the answer hundreds of times? Why are you so desperate to believe the people who you already recognize are harming our children?

It makes no sense.

Why would Walter Reed be any more trustworthy than Paul Offit or Senator Pan? Why would Jenner or Pasteur?

And you went no way to explaining my arguments against germ theory. If we are attacked by billions of viruses every day then if even a tiny fraction of them are pathogenic then we couldn't possibly survive. And even if we could, we would already be immune rendering every vaccine pointless. Once we had survived our first few days on earth, then we could never get sick again.

If that's wrong then we must conclude that precisely 0% of germs are pathogenic.

Plus your comment about the immune system completely misunderstood my point. The immune system does not allow us to overcome our math problem. In fact, it makes it worse.

You did provide one solitary example of a patient with what are presumably yellow fever symptoms but you didn't say whether they had been given any toxic medical treatments.

And like I said before, the whole "incubation period" is more than a little suspicious. Clearly they never found what they thought they would and just rigged the results to tell them what they want to hear.

Like every other germ theorist/vaccine promoter in history.

Hans,

As is obvious, there are many problems with vaccines. But, that being said, most of them usually work for a period of time to prevent the targeted diseases. The basic science behind vaccines is correct. Why do you think that within a few years (not many) of the introduction of the vaccines for them, pertussis, measles, mumps, rubella, tetanus, diphtheria, Hib disease, and chickenpox (and others) almost entirely disappeared? In the case of the routine childhood diseases, this was a bad thing, but it is a true thing.

Vaccines usually don't cause any obvious reactions. While they usually prevent the diseases, and that's why people continue to get them. With the increasing vaccination schedule, more and more are severely and permanently damaged, and it is immoral to mandate any vaccine for anyone for this reason. But it would also be immoral to prohibit vaccines for those who want them enough to take the risk.

Your article said as though it had any probative value that 90% of those who get pertussis had been vaxxed. The old DPT vaccine was MUCH more effective at preventing pertussis, but it was so dangerous (again, not to most, but to many), that developed countries replaced it with the acellular version, DTaP. From the beginning about twenty years ago, it was clear that it was not very effective and that huge numbers of vaxxed people got pertussis anyway, including my daughter who got pertussis at eight month old after having gotten three DTaPs. The pertussis vaccine continues to be very dangerous, and I do not recommend that anyone get it. It used to be a killer disease, but evolved to become much milder, to the extent that the disease is very rarely dangerous (usually only to newborns under three months old), while the vaccine is very dangerous. And they're trying to see how they can go back to the old DPT. This does not show that vaccine science has collapsed, but rather that the vaccine they developed to replace the DPT turned out to be much less effective than they first thought, while continuing to be much more dangerous than they first thought.

Your article extrapolated from that that modern medical science in general has collapsed, but that, again, is going too far. A older woman in Mexico City who is like my mother to me had a pacemaker inserted about two months ago to aid her failing heart, and it has restored her to optimism and energy, when she was despondent, weak, and close to death. I took my daughter to the dentist yesterday, who said she has three wisdom teeth coming in and that she said that the lower right one was sore. So, although I am cautious about X-rays, I made an appointment for a panoramic X-ray in a month to assess the wisdom teeth, and, if it seems appropriate, I'll take her to an oral surgeon to have one or more extracted under IV sedation, in his office, if possible (the dentist thought that it would be). And I am confident that there will be no serious problems, but this is thanks to technology and training in modern medicine that haven't been available for that long.

I think that everyone should inform himself on all medical procedures before agreeing to anything, but I also think that he should have access to any medical procedure which is reasonable (and opinions can differ as to that).

One problem is that you have not said how you think people should protect themselves against tetanus, bacterial meningitis, and yellow fever in the relevant cases, for example. These are diseases which healthy, well-nourished people used to die from very readily.

If most people stopped vaxxing and the mortality from these diseases rose to something like pre-vaccine levels, do you think they should just accept dying from them?

I put that in a separate paragraph because it is the crucial issue.

Hans, you are right that we are looking at one of the biggest crimes in all history. When I read the story of that poor girl who was so healthy and is now confined to a wheelchair after getting her third Gardasil shot I could not believe that Merck could produce such a toxic vaccine and give it out to girls like it was something they absolutely had to have only to be mislead and made into cripples. Merck should be prosecuted for the damage they have done to so many girls who got the Gardasil vaccine and were physically debilitated for life. There is a place for the people who perpetrated this crime on young girls and women and it is called hell. They have destroyed people's lives and gotten away with it. My heart goes out to those who have suffered this damage for no damn good reason except to help make huge profits for Merck!

The funny thing about Eindecker's claim saying lab tests prove that all of the data we are using has integrity is that the use of lab tests (even if they were accurate and unambiguous) actually proves the exact opposite.

We didn't require lab tests to prove measles cases before the vaccine. We do now - at least for sporadic cases - so the diagnostic criteria has been strengthened.

Making it harder to diagnose measles or polio etc *reinforces* my point about the "success" of these vaccines just being a self fulfilling prophecy.

That is, not only do most doctors not want to diagnose so-called VPDs but even if they do they have to jump through more hoops to do so.

But Eindecker didn't stop to think about this. How could he? This point of mine is devastating for his beliefs. He either admits he's wrong or he clutches at straws.

He chooses the latter. Perhaps this wouldn't be so bad except that I've already explained all of this to Eindecker but he continues to proffer up his "but but but lab tests!!!!" arguments anyway.

And thanks Almighty Pill you responded to the Walter Reed thing perfectly.

Hans,

I have said many times at this point that the yellow fever vaccine is more dangerous than most, and it often causes severe reactions, even fatal ones. But, as Eindecker said, it's a question of risks vs. benefits. He made an appropriate decision to refuse the vaccine when he went to Africa, informing himself as to the incidence of yellow fever in the countries he visited, and deciding based on that that the vaccine was not worth the risk involved. But it still remains true that VERY FEW of the millions who get the vaccine have a severe reaction to it, and that then they don't get yellow fever, and, as the nurse told Eindecker, the disease is very dangerous and often fatal. In this area there are never any guarantees either way, but the odds are unevenly weighted, but the people involved have to weigh them anyway and make a decision.

The theory of vaccines is correct. If you introduce a little of a pathogen into the body, then antibodies will be produced to it. In many cases this will mean that the person is immune to the targeted disease for an unknown length of time, sometimes for life, but usually for a lot less than that. The problems with vaccines are many: adjuvants like aluminum, preservatives like mercury and formaldehyde, the introduction of foreign proteins both in the modified pathogen, traces of the cell culture, and other ingredients, and the force and duration of the response to the vaccine by the individual immune system. And we don't know everything about the reactions: there are probably more dangers than we are aware of now.

It has always come down to a weighing of the risks and the benefits. If you live in an area with active yellow fever, then you will probably be willing to take a greater risk than if you were in little danger from the virus. I can't think of a crueler way to die than from yellow fever or other hemorrhagic diseases. Well, maybe Spanish flu, which is no longer with us. Healthy, well-nourished children whose fever is left alone (no fever reducers) are at close to zero risk from natural measles and the dangerous measles vaccine would be a bad choice. Minimal risk from the disease, should it occur, and it would be a boon for lifetime health if it did, great risk from the vaccine. I'm not even going to call it an acceptable choice, it would be the wrong choice. Those not at this minimal-risk end would have to do a more careful risk-benefit analysis, always bearing in mine the option of very safe, effective, inexpensive nosodes for all diseases.

Rtp,

It is nonsense to say that if it is not the case that if every case of every contagious disease is not positively lab-identified, then that proves that contagious disease does not exist. People have always recognized that disease travels from one person to another, although it was a long time before they understood germs and viruses, or the role of animals as carriers in many diseases. They used to put a cross on their door in medieval times to warn others of the existence of disease in their house. Later they put up quarantine orders, even before they knew of the existence of viruses. Yellow fever was surprising until Dr. Reed's work because it did not go from person to person the way they might have expected, and it popped up unexpectedly, striking only one person in a family, for instance, and then not spreading to others. And then they realized, and proved, that it was carried by mosquitoes, and everything became clear. Cuba made a monumental effort to eradicate mosquitoes, to the extent of examining every household in Cuba for standing water on the premises, and draining it and fining the homeowners if they had been apprised and ignored the directive.

I'll tell you how yellow fever was recognized in Reed's time and discuss malaria later, I have to take my daughter to the dentist now.

Cia -----Page 67 Plague Kent Heckenlively

Dr G Stuart to the World Health Organisation 1953

Two main objections to this vaccine have been voiced, because of the possibility that :

1. the mouse brains employed in its preparation may be contaminated with a virus pathogenic for man although latent in mice..... or may be the cause of demyelinating encephalomyelitis

2. the use, as antigen of a virus with enhanced neurotropic properties may be followed by serious reactions involving the central nervous system

You will never guess which Vaccine he was talking about ? Cia
Only your favourite vaccine of the moment, the Yellow Fever Vax-abomination
-------------------------------------------------------------
M.E
Estimates of the number of people with the condition vary from 7 to 3,000 per 100,000 adults.[7][8] About 836,000 to 2.5 million Americans and 250,000 people in the UK have CFS.

I note that Eindecker's entire worldview of vaccination is entirely dependent on the idea that 100.0% of the diagnoses of every single disease in all of human history have been made with a 100.0% unambiguous laboratory test.

If this is not the case then 100.0% of what Eindecker believes about germ theory and vaccine efficacy is complete nonsense.

Unfortunately for him the percentage of diagnoses in history made using reliable lab techniques would be more along the lines of 0.00001%. If that.

Which, I guess, would make every single one of his views "utter b*ll*ocks" wouldn't it?

Cia I have some experience with yellow fever vaccine, and the advice given by the NHS over here in the UK. We were going a holiday in Zimbabwe and Botswana 2 years ago and went to get the recommended vaccinations, we discussed yellow fever vaccine and the NHS advice with the GP practice nurse. She said there were potentially serious side effects from the vaccine but yellow fever is also a potentially fatal disease so we consulted the countries listed by the NHS where yellow fever was endemic and decided that the areas where we were visiting were not the risk areas. I felt fully informed and able to make an appropriate decision, we also had all the recommended vaccinations for these areas.
Regarding the views of RTP John Stone rather generously referred to them as fanciful, I’d prefer to use the appropriate English expression as a “load of b*ll*cks”. Bacterial meningitis is a classic case where specific vaccines have dramatically reduced the incidence of the various types of bacterial meningitis, as to RTP’s nonsense that doctors just rename diseases well the causative organism of bacterial meningitis is identified by laboratory tests of blood and or CSF, so there’s no role in doctors “renaming” the disease, one little bit nonsense you peddled recently was that measles had just been renamed roseola, unfortunately for you the causative viruses are different between the two diseases: the measles virus and herpes virus strains (HHV-6 & HHV-7) for roseola. The majority of measles cases are now laboratory confirmed for the measles virus serotype.
David Weiner I suggest you read about the history of polio eradication in Europe post WW2, different European countries introduced the vaccine at different times and surprisingly enough the eradication of polio in these various countries mirrored when the vaccines where introduced. Unfortunately there was a polio outbreak in the Netherlands in the 1970’s in a community that refused vaccination, there had been an 85% reduction in polio in Europe in the decade following the introduction of polio vaccine

Cia, what precise symptoms did Reed's volunteers all have? Were they merely adjudged to have yellow fever because that is what was consistent with Reed's prejudices or did they have symptoms that could only be attributed to yellow fever and nothing else?

And why is it that we don't all die from yellow fever and/or malaria given mosquitoes are, and have always been, completely ubiquitous?

Which do you think is more likely Cia? That Reed's experiments were specifically designed to tell him what he already believed or that a disease that is carried by mosquitoes just magically disappeared even though mosquitoes in Europe and the US are as common as ever?

Now I have quite an advantage on you over this you see because I happen to know that a self-replicating pathogen is not even mathematically possible. Eindecker won't help you out on this one either. I also know that the reason multiple people can come down with the same symptoms (siblings, classmates, colleagues - possibly even a country) is because of shared trauma not contagion. I know that contagion cannot possibly be true because if it were, only a madman would visit (let alone become) a doctor.

That is why I don't have much faith in 100 year old experiments. Which, by the way, many had tried before with zero success. Reed's experiments don't even make any sense. Why would an incubation period on the mosquito matter for the virus? If the mosquito gave you just one solitary viral particle then, under germ theory, you would get it because germ theory is not dose dependent. You would also die as under germ theory nobody can ever recover.

Clearly Reed was manipulating the results because he couldn't get it to work - just like everybody else - so he had to make up excuses and grasp at straws with things like "incubation period". That is one of those Deus ex Machina that the Almighty Pill pointed out.

David,

Thank you for the video link. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9hYRuWTRzs

The pro-vaxxers truly believe that their views on vaccination are scientifically correct. I do not doubt this. They firmly trust that current and previous government officials, and all our ancestors and great-ancestors got this right: vaccinations are safe and effective. That is their tradition that has been handed down to them. And they cannot imagine that such a tradition could be wrong.

Since the pro-vaxxers (mistakenly) believe that science is the basis of their beliefs many of the anti-vaxxers make the mistake of responding to their arguments with better science and better logical arguments. But as you and this video point out, this is mistaken view. Logical arguments will not change them; only relevant stories will.

The Almighty Pill,

If you were to read The American Plague, you would learn the answers to all of your questions. Early researchers had a difficult time when they first tried to deliberately cause yellow fever by letting loaded mosquitoes bite volunteers. The time frame turned out to be crucial, and when they lit on the method of letting aedes mosquitoes bit yellow fever victims in the first three days of the symptomatic disease, and then quickly bite a volunteer, they found an almost certain method of causing yellow fever.

I googled Dr. Noguchi last night, Japanese researcher on yellow fever and several other diseases. He worked with loaded yellow fever mosquitoes in Africa, and another researcher criticized him for being careless in keeping them confined. Many of them escaped and circled the lab, biting people. And that's how he himself caught yellow fever. Dr. Young, another yellow fever researcher, visited him in the hospital, where Dr. Noguchi asked Dr. Young if he were sure that he was quite well himself. Dr. Young said he was. Dr. Noguchi died the following day of yellow fever and Dr. Young died of yellow fever a week later.

All diseases have their own natural life cycles, undergoing predictable surges and lulls over time. Pertussis has worldwide peaks about every three and a half years, with vaccination not affecting that cycle at all. You could easily find information on these cycles on the Internet. One factor partially independent of this is that once the pathogen has infected most of the non-immunes in a community, it has no new victims, and dies down until there is a new group of non-immunes.

Denying the reality and dangers of contagious or infectious diseases is counter-productive. Most people know that these diseases are real and that some of them are potentially very dangerous. Each person has the right to make his own decision as to what to do about it, if anything. Good nutrition, sanitation, and hygiene are very important, as are breastfeeding babies and toddlers and avoiding drugs and vaccines whenever possible. Homeopathy is an excellent alternative. But epidemics are themselves proof of the reality of disease, and it seems strange for the need to insist on that. Not many people believe now nor ever will believe that germs don't cause disease, especially after they personally see the results of an epidemic of a dangerous disease. It doesn't mean they have to take a vaccine, but vaccines are one of their options, which usually induce immunity to the targeted disease, although of course their dangers must be considered as well.

Eindeker, are you out there? I've been wondering what your views on yellow fever are.

Hans,

I was addressing the comment which was posted to the effect that fear of disease is the problem, while disease is never a problem itself, and that neither viruses nor bacterial germs are ever a problem. Or parasites like malaria. Have you noticed that many comments are in response to another comment, with only, at most, tangential relevance to the topic of the main article? Would you censor such comments and the responses to them? What do you think the desired response to epidemics of deadly contagious diseases should be? I am aware of the dangers of vaccines and only recommend them when there is no better alternative when threatened by a potentially very serious disease, and even then only with free and informed consent. I don't think ignoring the deaths is a good option.

Here is another Jurassic Park quote I always believed applied to the pharna industry:
John Hammond: [Eating several bowls of ice cream, which were melting] They were all melting.
Ellie Sattler: Malcom's okay for now, I gave him a shot of morphine.
John Hammond: They'll be fine. Who better to get the children through Jurassic Park than a dinosaur expert? You know the first [swallows] attraction I built when I came down from Scotland... was a flea circus. Petticoat Lane.Really..quite wonderful. We had uh...a wee trapeze, a merry-go-... carousel.Heh. And a see-saw. They all moved, motorized, of course, but people would say they could see the fleas, "Oh, mummy! I can see the fleas, can't you see the fleas?" Clown fleas, highwire fleas and fleas on parade. But with this place... I wanted to give them something that wasn't an illusion.Something that was real. Something they could see, and touch. An aim not devoid of merit.
Ellie Sattler: But you can't think through this one, John. You have to feel it.
John Hammond: You're right, you're absolutely right. Hiring Nedry was a mistake, that's obvious, we're over-dependent on automation, I can see that now. Now the next time, everything's correctable. Creation is an act of sheer will. Next time it'll be flawless.
Ellie Sattler: It's still the flea circus. It's all an illusion.
John Hammond: When we have control again--
Ellie Sattler: You never had control! That's the illusion! I was overwhelmed by the power of this place. But I made a mistake, too. I didn't have enough respect for that power and it's out now. The only thing that matters now are the people we love. Alan and Lex and Tim...John,they're out there where people are dying. So...[takes a spoonful of ice cream;swallows] It's good.
John Hammond: Spared no expense.

Cia the subject of this thread is not the Yellow Fever Vaccine .
It is the fact that all of the childhood vaccines have been falsified in testing.
Not one of them tested against placebo but tested against each other.
And Gardasil was testing against the AAHS adjuvant (so not even sure where that placebo comes in).

Can you stay on topic please - tell us what you think about that ?

rtp,

I don't disagree with you about the importance of the efficacy argument. I think that our movement has not done enough to kill the lies surrounding polio and smallpox. These form the cornerstone of the vaccine zealots' attack strategy. Though I have seen more push back against the polio story lately. We should never concede that vaccines wiped out these diseases - BIG MISTAKE.

For those people who doubt my strategy you should probably consider the following two strange phenomena about our time right now.

According to opinion polls, never before have the people been as weary about vaccine dangers as they are now. According to one poll after another, something like half to two thirds of people have concerns about vaccine safety.

And yet, according to opinion polls - most people still support mandatory vaccination.

How could people hold both sets of views? Simple.

The ragtag bunch of moms and dads screaming about vaccine injury have in fact been highly successful. We have absolutely changed people's minds. You only have to go back 20 years and concerns over vaccines were nigh on non-existent. And yet we didn't have the hysteria over measles "outbreaks" like we do now.

So what happened?

The vaccine industry responded the way they were always going to respond. It wasn't to sit down with parents of vaccine injured children and sing Kumbaya and make everything better. It was to launch an all out attack using their best weapon. Fear of contagious disease.

This was easy to predict. And it was why I was telling people 15 years ago that if you didn't attack vaccine efficacy (and, if you were brave, germ theory) then we had virtually no hope of winning.

I could walk down the street, talk to 100 strangers and get 90 of them to believe that vaccines are more dangerous than we have been told. But the moment those 90 go to their doctors they will almost all be bullied into vaccinating with stories of plague and whatnot. On the other hand, if I persuade just 10 that germs are not particularly dangerous and/or the diseases have been renamed, none of those 10 will ever be bullied into vaccinating and what is more, they will be far more confident about projecting their arguments to others.

Our strategy has been a mile wide but an inch deep. Mine is the opposite. It would have taken a little bit longer to get some level of traction but the moment that traction was achieved and the vaccine industry thought it was important to responde, the entire paradigm would have been demolished within a couple of years.

Hans,

As always, I have no desire to interfere in whatever decisions you make for yourself. Yellow fever, after many years of low activity, has made a come-back in South America and in Africa. A number of tourists in Brazil have gotten it and some have died. They had not gotten the vaccine. There is no reason that it should not come back here. Many travelers go to Brazil or other endemic countries unvaxxed, get bitten by mosquitoes there, and come back to the US. If aedes mosquitoes bite them here and then bite others, well, that's how outbreaks start. I would recommend that travelers get the yellow fever nosode instead, but they should be aware that the danger exists. You don't think they should be? You may think the cases reported in the links below are inconsequential, ten cases in the last year of yellow fever in international travelers to Brazil, four deaths, 464 cases in people living in Brazil in the last year and a half, with 154 deaths, but they were important to those involved.

I recommend that most people refuse most vaccines (except DT, in the US, and in some circumstances the meningitis and rubella vaccines), but I think that those who will be in an area of active yellow fever would do well to consider that vaccine as well. It has NOTHING at all to do with measles or the measles vaccine. I have said many times that the yellow fever vaccine is more dangerous than most vaccines and it is a serious decision to make, taking into consideration general health, age, etc. But going to vacation in Africa or South America (or, soon, Miami or Houston) without giving it a second thought is foolish.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/67/wr/mm6711e1.htm
by DH Hamer - ‎2018 - ‎Cited by 38 - ‎Related articles
Mar 23, 2018 - Since January 2018, 10 travel-related cases of yellow fever, including four deaths, have been reported in international travelers returning from Brazil. None of the 10 travelers had received yellow fever vaccination.

https://www.uptodate.com/contents/yellow-fever
Dec 13, 2018 - Between July 1, 2017, and February 16, 2018, 464 confirmed human cases of yellow fever were reported in Brazil, including 154 deaths [33].

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-yellowfever/miami-among-cities-at-risk-from-yellow-fever-spread-study-idUSKBN1HP2BE

(speculative) What we're calling viruses are starting to sound like tools of DNA maintenance to me--this is with very, very little study on my part--and immune systems perhaps function in part to keep these "tools" in check, that is, maybe preventing more bodily "housekeeping" than the body's vital organs can tolerate or need at a time, but also perhaps more importantly in assisting the carrying out of this maintenance?

If that is an even viable theory, then a virus jumping species could be a seriously concerning event, particularly early on, maybe for generations, until the virus mutates to less "virulent" (possibly more adapted to host) forms or immune systems memory (whatever all that entails) put this new invader in check. Though I personally don't hold much hope for the practice of antibody stimulation (an end and not even necessary part of the immune system process from what I understand) via injection to become an overall beneficial intervention in such events, and I really question the intervention in terms of "preventing infections" we've evolved/were designed to exist with.

Further, if infections actually serve to reduce bodily pollution levels (perhaps clearing DNA mutating metals, etc) either as part of this "housekeeping" process or just added benefit, then it seems like we're completely going at things backwards with the practice of vaccination, enhanced with "adjuvants" today (nevermind that we're creating more and more opportunities for viruses to jump species, recombine, revert, mutate, etc. with our "biological laboratories").

rtp,

I finished the book on yellow fever, The American Epidemic, last night, and I would recommend that you read it to see just how dangerous some viruses are. The last chapter describes how, after several volunteers, including doctors, willingly let themselves be bitten by "loaded" mosquitoes, got yellow fever after a few days and died of it, many doctors and scientists researching the virus and the disease got yellow fever and died of it. Dr. Jesse Lazear, Dr. Hideyo Noguchi, Dr. Adrian Stokes, Dr. William Young, Dr. Paul Lewis, and Dr. Theodore Hayne are a few of them. One of Dr. Reed's original team, Dr. James Carroll, was permanently damaged by his bout with yellow fever and later died of complications from it.

One interesting thing I learned was: "In spite of carrying a single, simple strand of RNA, yellow fever does not mutate easily. Instead, flaviviruses like yellow fever somehow disable the body's immune respone - a process that continues to elude scientists. When the body encounters the virus, it mounts a mass campaign against the foreign invader on two fronts. White blood cells known as B cells create antibodies that cleave to the virus and mark the virus for destruction. At the same time, Killer T cells search out infected cells and destroy them. During the several days it takes to organize and implement this counterattack, the virus courses through the body, taking over kidney cells, liver cells, breaking down blood vessels until the organs themselves fail, and blood flows uncontrollably. There is no way to stop it unless the body can mobilize its forces before the virus has taken hold - that is what a vaccine does." (226-7)

As for proving that it is caused by a virus transmitted by mosquitoes, that proof has been carried out many times. Many healthy young volunteers have allowed themselves to be bitten by mosquitoes which have been seen to bite patients with yellow fever in the first three days of the disease, and have then come down with yellow fever themselves within a few days. And many of them died of it. Clara Maas was a nurse who hoped that if she got yellow fever herself she would have immunity and be able to nurse yellow fever patients. (Lena Angevine was the nurse who had gotten yellow fever at nine years old when all the rest of her family had been found dead of it, boarded up in their house. She was later the nurse of Jesse Lazear because she was immune to it.) Clara Maas died of it. The virus has been identified as well. I don't see how you could get any more proof than we now have that this is an extremely dangerous virus which often kills.

And I learned that at this time, the aedes aegypti mosquito, one of several which can transmit yellow fever, is now found all across the southern states, certainly here where I live. Several South American countries used DDT to eliminate that mosquito from their countries, but it has been many decades since DDT was used here. I learned that it is now considered certain that outbreaks of yellow fever will occur in the US: there is nothing to stop this from occurring. It's just something to think about and consider what we ought to do when that happens. I don't think the vaccine should be routinely given and it should always be voluntary, never mandated, but mandatory quarantine might become necessary, and that would be a reasonable step when such an outbreak occurs.

I couldn't remember where I saw the following quotation last week, but it was in the book, p 209. "In recent years, popular attention has been drawn to...Ebola as the most frightening emerging infection of humankind. However, patients with yellow fever suffer as terrifying and untreatable a clinical disease, and yellow fever is responsible for 1000-fold more illness and death than Ebola." (Lancet Infectious Diseases 2001)

I also learned that it is not permitted to give the yellow fever vaccine to those over 75 years old, and many say that it is too dangerous to give to those over 55. The disease tends to be more severe in those over 30. But for those who are or may be exposed to the disease, it is worth careful consideration. Many millions in yellow-fever endemic countries, and those who are going to travel in those countries, have gotten the vaccine without reaction and have also not gotten yellow fever. It IS a calculated risk, but may be worth it for healthy young and youngish people. But there are no grounds for saying that yellow fever does not exist or that it is not a dangerous, often fatal, disease.

John: Agreed about Plotkin. Gates without the money. Harks back to the deep, dark days of eugenics, which is still with us.

Holly,
Your plight is terrible but not unheard of before. I'm guessing it's you giving the majority of the care to your daughter, in which case you should have the final say on medical options. But I don't suppose that logic would cut any ice with those corrupt lawyers.

rtp

Well, so long as that is clear.

Any honest person would be mea-culpa,but then the big pharma vaccines were never big on honesty to start.So nothing to own up to.

Well done all another nail in the pharma coffin.

Pharma For Prison

MMR RIP

Whose got time to be concerned with proper placebo controls being used to test the products forcibly injected into one’s children! We’re in a STATE OF EMERGENCY here! Don’t you know there are women and children seeking refuge at out southern border and 35 CASES OF MEASELS in the Pacific NW!!!

Yeesh! Priorities people!

rtp

With the best will in the world I don’t think you can rhetorise sickness out of existence like that - you are probably sincere but ultimately it is whimsy, I fear. However, it is not more fantastic than the view of Offit, or so many British health officials or the RSPH that people, infants even, can withstand an indefinite barrage of vaccine products without risking harm. If anything it is rather similar.

Gary

I don’t really think Fred’s a sociopath, more a grumpy old man. I am not very keen on the term but it strikes me that Plotkin goes beyond something like mere sociopathy.

A prodigious amount of work and important service performed by ICAN!

HHS, all the agencies that signed on to Azar's falsifiable response get paid to do what? Work for the industry shareholders and betray those they're charge to protect?!? If you consider what that small "saline placebo" arm of the Gardasil trials actually was (the only "placebo" in the chart at 36 minutes)...a carrier solution tested against a lower-aluminum formulation for a theoretical-at-this-point-if-not-forever "cancer prevention" vaccine than was then marketed to/mandated on to all 9-15 year olds shortly afterwards... It's like we're at the regressive stage of having to establish with our regulatory agencies, "What part (if not all parts) of SAFETY RESEARCH don't you understand?!?"

Truth is bitter. When the governments stop working for people and start working for special interest lobbying corporate monopolistic groups (like Big Pharma Vaccine industry), they cannot handle truth that Vaccines are two edged swords and can cause enormous damage in most kids while seem to protect against a miniscule of least possible diseases less than placebos. Hence, they don't placebo test the vaccines and desperately trying to shut down the Web to stifle the Truth.

Thanks, John. They no longer have a single leg to stand upon. All they have left is lies and bullying.

I sent a link to the story to my school district superintendent since the district was promoting the flu vaccine on their Facebook page.

My hope is that one day, in the not so far future, the pharmaceutical companies and the people in charge of our health (FDA, AMA, etc) will be brought to Justice and this medical tyranny will be exposed and brought to a sudden end.

Excellent article! Not to be critical, but the first paragraph needs some editing.

We seem to be approaching an 'Irresistible force (truth) meeting an immovable object (Powers that Be). How long will it take?

Great article, John. Thank you.

"The manufacturers did this: the governments, the politicians and the regulators (internationally) let it happen."

Yes they did .. aided and abetted by every professional medical organization .. APA, AMA, etc .. public health bureaucracies .. HHS, CDC, FDA … and … a conspiracy of indifference by major media outlets who will simply IGNORE Del Bigtree's "88 pages" of irrefutable evidence revealing the complete lack of concern for the SAFETY OF MILLIONS OF CHILDREN. Consider what Bigtree's letter revealed:

".....they established that none of the vaccines those vaccines had been trialed against had ever been trialed against genuine placebo either. At the end of the line the toxic products were only being compared with other toxic products, rather than against saline."

That vaccines had been approved absent ANY trials against a genuine placebo is beyond simple mistake or omission .. it is deliberate effort to DECEIVE parents as to the SAFETY of the vaccines they are recommended to administer to their children.

In my humble opinion … THAT DELIBERATE DECEPTION IS CRIMINAL MALFEASANCE …. and should be PROSECUTED AS A CRIME.

We are looking at quite the biggest crime in all history.
There is no doubt.