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Dachel Wake Up: Merck Hopes to "Scare Up" Adult Vaccination Rates

Vaccines: It’s Up to You

Risk Demands Choice Age of Autism Vaccine MandatesBy Cathy Jameson

A few weeks ago, I shared part of an online conversation I had about vaccines.  Initially, I was hesitant to reply but after rereading a callous response made by a woman I’d never met, I needed say something.  Demanding that everyone should be vaccinated no matter what, I thought I might offer this person a bit caution in making such broad and ignorant demands. 

I challenged her.  In reply, she challenged me. 

Several hours one evening, we went back and forth with a mostly polite verbal vaccine volley.  She regurgitated typical propaganda while I went deeper sharing some actual vaccine experience.  I could’ve walked away at any point of the conversation.  I own nothing to this person, but with how condescending this gal was, I wasn’t ready to let her have the last word.  I’m glad I didn’t.  The next day, other parents who’d been reading the thread chimed in.  Some were as knowledgeable as I am about vaccine injury and offered their input.  As that weekend wrapped up so did the conversation.

Thinking the convo was completely over, I woke up a few days later to a notification showing that things had picked back up.  The lady who made the callous remark came back trying to give us vaccine hesitant parents a what for.  She was adamant in that there should be some sort of punishment, like a fine, for anyone who willingly declined vaccines. 

Oh, boy. 

I got ready for Round 2.

I had stuck to basic vaccine facts in the original replies, but decided to share more personal information that day.  I let her know that both my boys were vaccine injured.  That happened after both my boys received the recommended vaccines.  One on my boys received the full series while the other did not.  The one who got all the shots didn’t fare well at all.  As a result of his vaccines, he’s got seizures, a severe speech delay, and regressive autism.  I shared that what killed me most is that those shots did nothing for him.  None of them gave him any immunity for the diseases the vaccines would supposedly prevent.  I added that for her to come in again guns-a-blazing demanding that all people be fully vaccinated is absolutely ludicrous.  And downright rude. 

Here again, I had hoped that a clearer explanation of why I’m not a big fan of vaccines would garner some sort of compassion.  I even dared to think that she would back off a tiny bit, too.  But this other person believed in vaccines so passionately that she was still ready to round up the horrible parents who don’t do their bit for the greater good. 

I know you can’t rationalize with an irrational person.  I know I should’ve walked away when she pulled the greater good card out.  But by golly, she was going to get an earful and then some.

In not so many words and through gritted teeth that she could not see, I let her know that her argument to vaccinate all and now and with every vaccine was ridiculous.  I politely reminded her that I would not kowtow to anyone about vaccines, especially to a stranger who has absolutely no respect for other humans who think differently than she.  And this whole ‘greater good’ argument?  Please.  According to that thinking, the greater good includes all of us – including my child.  The one I just told her about.  The one who got vaccines.  The one who never gained immunity from vaccines.  The one who got sick after vaccines.  The one who lost gained skills after vaccines.  What about his good?  Doesn’t that count?  Doesn’t what happened to him matter?  Even just a little bit??  With how his body didn’t handle them, I’m not willing to take the risk to see how he does with other vaccines.  He should not be forced into any medical procedures, especially since several of them failed him already.  And stop with who’s required to take care of whom.  I’m responsible for my child’s health, not you and certainly not the public.  Thankfully the doctors who treat my child respect me.  Better than that – they support me and my decision to be cautious.  And this claim that vaccines protect the community?  In a perfect world they may protect an individual, but they don’t cross over and miraculously protect everyone.  Our immune systems don’t work in synergy like that.  It’s a nice Good Luck with Vaccinesthought though. 

Before I was done, I let her know how grateful I was for vaccine choice and that I would continue to exercise that right for the time being.  I also restated that if she wanted to vaccinate herself, she had every right to do just that.  Go for it!  No one is stopping her.  Then, because I needed to be done and to walk away completely from her negativity, I ended my thoughts with a nice little, ‘Good luck with your vaccines!’    

And I meant it.    


Good luck with them, lady. 

Because when they fail, because sometimes they actually do, you won’t have the pharmaceutical company on your side.  You won’t have your doctor on your side.  You won’t have your government on your side either.  You’ll only have yourself to get you through whatever mess your vaccines leave behind. 

Cathy Jameson is a Contributing Editor for Age of Autism.


Hans Litten

Cia : "why do almost no dogs get rabies anymore? "

Vaccinosis is a set of symptoms that occurs after the administration of a vaccine(s). These symptoms are more commonly referred to as adverse reactions or events occurring within minutes.

And yet this condition is widely know and accepted in the veterinary profession .
(But somehow they cleverly make sure the public is kept in the dark)

Hans Litten

Here are your vaccine preventable diseases (its all lies Cia - all lies) :

I’ll add a few details. It was routine for doctors all over America to send blood samples from patients they’d diagnosed with Swine Flu, or the “most likely” Swine Flu patients, to labs for testing. And overwhelmingly, those samples were coming back with the result: not Swine Flu, not any kind of flu.

That was the big secret. That’s what the CDC was hiding. That’s why they stopped reporting Swine Flu case numbers. That’s what Attkisson had discovered. That’s why she was shut down.

But it gets even worse.

Because about three weeks after Attkisson’s findings were published on the CBS News website, the CDC, obviously in a panic, decided to double down. If one lie is exposed, tell an even bigger one. A much bigger one.

Here, from a November 12, 2009, WebMD article is the CDC’s response: “Shockingly, 14 million to 34 million U.S. residents — the CDC’s best guess is 22 million — came down with H1N1 swine flu by Oct. 17 [2009].” (“22 million cases of Swine Flu in US,” by Daniel J. DeNoon).

Are your eyeballs popping? They should be.

In the summer of 2009, the CDC secretly stops counting Swine Flu cases in America, because the overwhelming percentage of lab tests from likely Swine Flu patients shows no sign of Swine Flu or any other kind of flu.

There is no Swine Flu epidemic.

Then, the CDC estimates there are 22 MILLION cases of Swine Flu in the US.

So…the premise that the CDC would never lie about important matters like, oh, a vaccine increasing the risk of autism…you can lay that one to rest.

The CDC will lie about anything it wants to. It will boldly go where no person interested in real science will go.

Hans Litten

ciaparker | December 02, 2016 at 02:11 PM

I missed one very important one out XMRV which is hidden in the MMR I understand.
The Plague - Kent Heckenlivery

On July 22, 2009, a special meeting was held with twenty-four leading scientists at the National Institutes of Health to discuss early findings that a newly discovered retrovirus was linked to chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS), prostate cancer, lymphoma, and eventually neurodevelopmental disorders in children. When Dr. Judy Mikovits finished her presentation the room was silent for a moment, then one of the scientists said, “Oh my God!” The resulting investigation would be like no other in science.

For Dr. Mikovits, a twenty-year veteran of the National Cancer Institute, this was the midpoint of a five-year journey that would start with the founding of the Whittemore-Peterson Institute for Neuro-Immune Disease at the University of Nevada, Reno, and end with her as a witness for the federal government against her former employer, Harvey Whittemore, for illegal campaign contributions to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid.

On this journey Dr. Mikovits would face the scientific prejudices against CFS, wander into the minefield that is autism, and through it all struggle to maintain her faith in God and the profession to which she had dedicated her life. This is a story for anybody interested in the peril and promise of science at the very highest levels in our country.



Not many would accept that the existence of even one undisclosed vaccine ingredient invalidates the entire vaccine industry. Everyone has known for decades about the problems with even disclosed ingredients like mercury, aluminum, formaldehyde, antifreeze, etc., in vaccines. Those who are interested have been aware of the dangers of all foreign protein in vaccines, and of the undisclosed existence of adjuvants like peanut oil in some vaccines. Current practice is terrible, illegal, and reprehensible, and all efforts are rightly made to disclose the fraudulent, dangerous practices.

But at the same time all parents need to at least consider the dangers of the VPDs and how much at risk their children would be if they refused the vaccines because of so many unknowns. Many will reject them all, and that would probably be the best thing to do in the case of most children. But if parents research it and decide that the dangers of tetanus and Hib disease are great enough to warrant taking the risk of the vaccines for them, they should be allowed to do so. My daughter and I both got tetanus boosters in 2005, and had no discernible reaction. I let her get three Hib vaccines as an infant, refusing the fourth after I learned that it increased the risk of diabetes. It wouldn't have been a huge risk if I had refused all of them since she was breast fed, but I didn't have all the information then that I have now. That being said, she didn't appear to react to the ones she got, while she had terrible reactions to the hep-B at birth (the only one she got) and to the DTaP booster at 18 months.

Most people have gotten a lot of vaccines and had no discernible reaction, and I understand and agree that most have damaged their immune systems in ways that they'll probably never know. But I think parents must consider the 20,000 a year who got invasive Hib disease thirty years ago and assess their personal situation to decide what they think the safest course of action would be. If a baby is not breastfed and is in daycare, then it might be a good idea to take the risk of the vaccine. But I don't think that knowing that pharma companies have lied about vaccine ingredients should be a determining factor in their decision: the Hib vaccine stamped out invasive Hib disease almost overnight thirty years ago, even though it did have a number of dangers. It has to be a conscious matter of weighing risks, benefits, and unknowns in an individual situation. And it's always possible for anyone to make a decision he'll later regret.


ciaparker, a lively discussion you've prompted here. Thanks for your input. There are some historical 'facts' attributing the declining rates of disease to vaccines that you should probably revisit. Take a look at the historical epidemiological charts on Suzanne Humphries website at Her book 'Dissolving Illusions' was one of the more fascinating and well researched I've read out of the dozen related books read over the last 2 months. You, like many other concerned parents and others looking at the efficacy and safety of vaccines make the logical assumption that VACCINES ARE RESPONSIBLE for the reduction in the various infectious diseases and that without them, we would return to the days of old where people were dying in droves. I myself have struggled to reconcile what I've believed to be true with the historical record which paints a very different picture.

There are obviously two camps here; One group who believes in vaccinated immunity but wants 'safe' vaccines; A second group that does not believe in the concept of vaccinated immunity.

When I was a kid, I got the measles. No big deal, I got to stay home and watch cartoons for a week. I also got chicken pox, same deal. I probably needed a break. Also got pneumonia once. The benefit to me from having those mild versions of diseases is a lifelong immunity. I could go to a measley kids birthday party at Disneyland and not likely get the measles. A lot of those kids who got the measles in Disneyland were vaccinated. So much for lifelong immunity. Boosters? Why? Because the vaccine failed at what it was supposed to do? You betcha'. If we attempt to prevent the mild, the virus is most likely to mutate to something stronger.

I'm also mildly irritated with the focus solely on Thimerosal as the primary cause of autism. It may be one of the most significant factors, but most everyone would agree that it's more complicated. Autism may be one of the most recognizable of conditions, but is only one of a myriad number of conditions that could have common root causes. The autism rate may be 1 in 60-70, but when you add in the kids like my son, with ADHD, S&L challenges, slight autistic tendencies? It's all the same dang thing, just different levels. I guess I'm lucky he's not worse off. Born in 2004, he may have escaped much of the thimerosal, but not the aluminum and other elements. Did he acquire some of mom and dad's toxic load (amalgam fillings and a fair share of tuna)? Genetics, definitely... MTHFR++, COMT++. Did he get vaccines during his first year when he had reflux and threw up 20x a day? Yeh, I believe the pediatrician still stabbed him. The PPI's, the antibiotics?? Was the soy formula they recommended a factor (glyphosate, et al)? I've spent over $300k on special schools to date (6 years worth). It's a burden financially and emotionally. I have an assortment of holistic doctors and practitioners and have done a lot of what they've prescribed, which is a lot. Significant improvement is elusive, but I am determined to do everything possible to address root cause.

It's a shame that direct attribution of vaccines with autism, even with a large volume of current and future studies, is unlikely to result in a revolution. Some of these vaccines/agents will quietly disappear without anyone admitting responsibility, but given the expanded vaccination schedule, it seems unlikely. Even if all vaccines became magically 'safe', it still leaves the question of vaccinated immunity. Of course, using 'safe' and 'vaccines' in the same sentence is a paradox.



Vaccines can be devastatingly harmful, disable or kill. That is beyond dispute. But if you don't think that any vaccine ever works to prevent disease, why do almost no dogs get rabies anymore? Why do less than 25 children a year get invasive Hib disease now, when thirty years ago, until the vaccine, 10,000 children a year were getting it? With 5% dying and 25% being permanently disabled by the disease, even with antibiotic treatment at a hospital. Why are chickenpox and measles so rare now if not for the vaccines for them (and it would be better for the vast majority if children continued to get them, but they don't)? Vaccines cause antibodies to be produced by a certain technique. Do you not believe that people with these antibodies, albeit artificially produced, usually have protection against the targeted disease?

I think we need to give people the facts to the greatest extent possible, and then let them make a decision whether or not to get the vaxxes. It would be possible to say that you think the interests of the herd are better served by no one's getting any vaxxes, and I think that would be true for the vast majority. But you have to then say that you don't think a thousand children a year dying from Hib disease, 2,500 permanently disabled by it, are enough to justify anyone's getting the vax. And that gets into the realm of a personal belief system which people have different opinions on. And the parents of concrete children have the right to get or refuse any vaccine. They will have to carry the burden if the child reacts to a vaccine with autism, SIDS, etc., but also if they refuse a vaccine and the child dies or is mentally or physically disabled from Hib meningitis. Both outcomes are possible.

Hans Litten

ciaparker | December 01, 2016 at 01:59 PM

The very existence of even one secret undeclared ingredient invalidates the whole vaccination industry :

sv40 (120M americans)
HCG (Kenya 2015 - the Nazis would be proud)
Contaminants of unknown nature , unknown viruses
DNA RNA of human\animal species

That is even before we talk about the metals . And formaldehyde , polysorbate80 , latex and the rest of the junk .

So I am sorry Cia but vaccines are a fraud , failure & most of all a crime !
The biggest crime in history ever .

Jeannette Bishop

Re: scarlet fever vaccine, my limited understanding is there was at least one that was tried without good results.



They did make several scarlet fever vaccines, but they caused so many serious side effects that they were withdrawn from the market and were never widely used.

I think we need to accept that the issues are complex, and the same product can have great benefits for some while causing great harm to others. I understand that aluminum in vaccines is dangerous, and that vaccines often cause autoimmune disease as well as neurological and other diseases. But at the same time, most vaccines are effective in preventing the target diseases. Those who would have died of the diseases without the vaccine were benefited, while those who were harmed by the vaccine weren't. I think we should just let the childhood diseases come back, and if not many people took the MMR or pertussis vaccines, the rate of adverse vaccine reactions of all kinds would plummet. And absolutely stop the hep-B vaccine except for the babies of infected mothers. But it has to be left up to the parent to make the final decision.

I understand and agree that the pharma industry is corrupt, dishonest, and greedy. Nothing it says should be taken at face value. But at the same time we should remember that Hib disease killed and disabled thousands of American children a year until the vaccine wiped it out (and started the epidemic of peanut allergy and increased the diabetes rate). Can't we say that all these statements are true and try to make a decision bearing all of them in mind? Sixty years ago polio destroyed the lives of tens of thousands of children and their families, and the vaccines stopped it. Same thing, yes, the vaccine for a long time was contaminated with simian virus which could cause cancer. Both things are true. Eighty years ago diphtheria was the children's angel of death, the biggest killer of children, and the vaccine stopped it. My mother had a little neighbor in the '30s who died of diphtheria: her voice always quavered when she remembered how his family called in every doctor in town, but he still died, asphyxiated. And on the other hand, my grandparents got the diphtheria vaccine for their children, and my mother reacted to it with Asperger's and bowel disease. My father saw a man in the '30s die of tetanus. In the early '60s many babies were born with congenital rubella syndrome which caused severe birth defects. Nothing of this proves that it's better to get the vaccines than to go vaccine-free, but it is information which should be borne in mind and considered.

Scarlet fever has almost disappeared on its own, with no vaccine being able to take the credit. Diseases all have their own trajectory beyond human influence. The bubonic plague has almost disappeared with no vaccine, and TB even here where the BCG has never been given routinely, and sweating sickness in the UK in the sixteenth century. Terrible diseases which killed many thousands of people, and then they disappeared. But that doesn't tell us what we should do today about the diseases which do pose threats here and now. I would say parents should think about the tetanus series after the age of two (DT, not DTaP), and, if a child is not breastfed, then think about the Hib meningitis vaccine. And think about refusing the others. No mandates either way, it's always possible for someone to die of flu or even something like mumps or chickenpox at any time, any age, though not likely. And then stay alert in case an old disease becomes more virulent and common than now.

Diphtheria rates were declining before the vaccine, it's unclear how much the vaccine did to stop it. Smallpox disappeared at a time when few in the US were taking the vaccine anyway. Pertussis was declining. Measles declined in virulence but not in incidence: 99% of children continued to get measles until the vaccine stopped it (not a good thing, but it stopped it, and saved some lives while taking others). Hib disease just increased in incidence and virulence from 1940 until it was stopped by the vaccine around 1990. And that was before the vaccine epidemic started.

Hans Litten

John Stone | December 01, 2016 at 10:39 AM

Yes John , my favourite vaccine , the scarlett fever vaccine . Because they were unable to make one !
But yes I'm sure the immunologists are still claiming SF disappeared because of vaccines (scoundrels) -

John Stone


I took Hans's comment to be a leg-pull - pointing out the decline of the disease despite the fact that every knows there has never been a vaccine, but who knows?

Gary Ogden

Hans Litten: When and where was the scarlet fever vaccine ever widely used? It was a major killer in the 19th century until the sanitation revolution, but the mortality rate fell precipitously by the early 20th century, long before antibiotics existed. Nothing was eradicated by medicine. It is now a largely forgotten disease, yet "Even today, the organism [Streptococcus pyogenes] innocently colonizes 15-20 percent of school children and remains ever present." Dissolving Illusions, pp. 47-48 and 192-193.

Hans Litten

Safe & effective (you damn scoundrels) :

Regarding those who have had a previous adverse reaction to vaccines, the paper cites five relevant studies including the case of a death of a teenage girl six months following her third Gardasil injection against HPV virus. She had experienced a range of symptoms shortly after her first dose, including dizziness, numbness and tingling in her hands, and memory lapses. After her second injection, she developed “intermittent arm weakness, frequent tiredness requiring daytime naps,” worse tingling, night sweats, chest pain and palpitations. A full autopsy was unrevealing but blood and spleen tissue analysis revealed HPV-16 L1 gene DNA fragments – matching the DNA found in vials of the Gardasil vaccine against cervical cancer – “thus implicating the vaccine as a causal factor.” The DNA fragments had also been found to be “complexed with the aluminum adjuvant” which, according to the report, have been shown to persist for up to 8 to 10 years causing chronic immune system stimulation.

“Although data is limited,” Shoenfeld and his colleagues concluded, “it seems preferable that individuals with prior autoimmune or autoimmune-like reactions to vaccinations, should not be immunized, at least not with the same type of vaccine.”

Hans Litten

For Cia

No one would accuse Yehuda Shoenfeld of being a quack. The Israeli clinician has spent more than three decades studying the human immune system and is at the pinnacle of his profession. You might say he is more foundation than fringe in his specialty; he wrote the textbooks. The Mosaic of Autoimmunity, Autoantibodies, Diagnostic Criteria in Autoimmune Diseases, Infection and Autoimmunity, Cancer and Autoimmunity – the list is 25 titles long and some of them are cornerstones of clinical practice. Hardly surprising that Shoenfeld has been called the “Godfather of Autoimmunology” – the study of the immune system turned on itself in a wide array of diseases from type 1 diabetes to ulcerative colitis and multiple sclerosis.
But something strange is happening in the world of immunology lately and a small evidence of it is that the Godfather of Autoimmunology is pointing to vaccines – specifically, some of their ingredients including the toxic metal aluminum – as a significant contributor to the growing global epidemic of autoimmune diseases. The bigger evidence is a huge body of research that’s poured in in the past 15 years, and particularly in the past five years. Take for example, a recent article published in the journal Pharmacological Research in which Shoenfeld and colleagues issue unprecedented guidelines naming four categories of people who are most at risk for vaccine-induced autoimmunity.

Hans Litten

ciaparker | November 30, 2016 at 07:42 PM

Cia , I think the same can be said of the virulent scarlett fever , it was also a big killer , and it wasn't until the vaccine became widely used that we finally saw it brought under control .
I think you have a very strong point , and I find myself being turned partially into a pro-vaccine stance.



Incidence of Hib meningitis was NOT going down before the vaccine. Antibiotic treatment for it was usually effective, but not always: even with treatment, 5% died and 25% were permanently damaged by it. The highest rate was in 1982. The first vaccine, one dose at 18 months, I think, was introduced in 1985. The three-dose series was introduced in 1988, but not widely given until 1990. For several years they didn't give it to infants, so those most at risk of serious disease, those between six and twelve months, didn't get it. And incidence of Hib meningitis plummeted to close to zero in just a couple of years.

I'm not saying parents should get the vaccine. I'm saying they might want to get it after learning the pros and cons.


It is funny how adults like Cathy's online critic never seem to be aware that in reality, even if they have had every shot their doctor recommended; that if they were born after the 80's; they are" unvaxxed."

Kids who miss a couple of shots, even one shot, are considered unvaxxed. It doesn't really matter if she lined up for her annual flu shot or not. In California right now, kids who miss just one shot areconsidered too dangerous to go to school. people from before the 80's haven't had their Hepatitis B shots. It wasn't on the schedule back then. Doesn't really matter if they have no risk factors, and are in a monogamous relationship. According to this lady, we all should "know" five year olds without the hep B shot are too dangerous to be around.
Why is an adult any safer? And we know those adults haven't had "enough" boosters anyway. The schedule changed to add more because more boosters were needed, right?
So the lady giving you all this hassle is most likely unvaxxed by the standards she is holding the kids to, and even if she was born in the 80's, she better stay away from anyone older than her. It doesn't matter even if those adults were "mostly vaxxed" or completely vaxxed according to the schedule of their childhood. There is no room for any exception to the mandates, and they could be infecting her with Hep B as we speak.( ( HEP B may be primarily blood born , and sexually transmitted, but no matter what her lifestyle is, even if she is a nun, she has to be at least as much at risk as a two month old baby, or a five year old, right?) And then there is Hib,, and Hep A , and Varicella, and that extra MMR shot that she is missing..
Those older adults are just too dangerous for anyone to be around. I hope if she is older than 36, she is staying away from the grocery stores and she is working from home because of her serious infectious potential..If she is younger, then she better make sure she doesn't stand next to someone older at the grocery store, and she needs to keep away from her parents....


Linda, I read the one in 200 babies in a parenting magazine when Cecily was a baby. I see that a study by Sells says that it was one in 350 children under five. It's possible the magazine was wrong, or it's possible that it was that high in babies between six months and two years old, the age with the higest incidence, and lower in those between two and five, averaging out at one in 350. There are figures here for the total number in the country which it would be easy to calculate using the total number of children in that year, I think it was 1984, with the highest number of cases ever.

These are some of the sources of the information which I have read and believe to be accurate. From The Solution: Homeoprophylaxis: The Vaccine Alternative, p. 80: "Haemophilus influenzae type b is a bacterium that is believed to be responsible for a variety of invasive syndromes particularly severe in infants. (NB: invasive means that the germs get from the respiratory passages where most people usually carry them to systems designed to be sterile, like the bloodstream and the brain.) It is a bacterium that normally resides in the mucous membranes but can become a risk in infants and young children. Breast feeding and passive immunity from the mother protect the infant in the early months. It is not known how these normal bacteria become pathogenic and develop into invasive disease.

Epiglottitis begins with swelling between the base of the tongue and the epiglottis with a very high fever. The swelling of the epiglottis results in a dry croaking voice, difficulty breathing, and blockage of the airways resulting in suffocation.

Cellulitis is a rapidly progrssing, potentially life-threatening skin infection which usually involves the face, head, or neck.

Meningitis is inflammation of the cerebral and spinal meninges: the membrane that covers the brain and spinal cord. This inflammation can be the result of either viral or bacterial infection, or systemic reaction to another illness such as Haemophilus. The condition is classified as a medical emergency due to the proximity of the brain and possibility for brain damage. If meningitis is suspected, give the indicated homeopathic remedies on the way to the hospital.

Symptoms: headache, neck stiffness, arching of the back, with a high fever, confusion, or altered consciousness, and possibly seizures. Inability to tolerate light or loud noises. Nausea, vomiting, and tiredness. If the condition is bacterial, there may be a fine blotching of the skin. The condition may become septic, with rapid heart rate and breathing. Seek professional help if child makes high-pitched cries and moans, child has a stiff neck or is arching his back, fever goes over 103, throat and airways become constricted, or skin lesions are becoming infected. "

Dr. Randall Neustaedter, The Vaccine Guide, p. 185 et seq.: "Mortality from Hib meningitis is 3 to 8% (Sell, 1987). Sensorineural (permanent) hearing loss occurs in about 10% of meningitis cases (Dodge 1984), though this is more common with pneumococcal (Prevnar) meningitis. Appropriate treatment of Hib meningitis includes the use of a cephalosporin (or other) antibiotic, administered intravenously.

The estimated incidence of Hib meningitis was about 12,000 cases a year before the licensing of the Hib vaccine, plus an additional 7,500 cases of invasive disease (lungs, heart, etc.) Before the Hib vaccine, about 1 in 350 children younger than five years of age developed Hib meningitis (Sell 1987). In 1995, five years after the vaccine became available for infants, the total reported incidence of invasive disease was 1,300 cases (Bisgard 1998). This 98% reduction in Hib invasive disease has been attributed to the vaccine campaign. ..

This new vaccine (he was writing in 2002), relatively untested and questionably effective, presents a difficult decision for parents. Meningitis is not a mild childhood disease. Haemophilus meningitis was not uncommon prior to widespread use of the vaccine. ..Parents should weigh the likelihood of exposure against their feelings about the known adverse effects of Hib vaccine, including the ability of the vaccine to suppress immune system function and cause an increased susceptibility to Hib disease. A parent's philosophy about immune system competence, unknown effects of vaccines, and the politics of vaccine campaign promotion will always enter into the decision process when a new vaccine is marketed for a serious disease."

Aviva Jill Romm, Vaccinations: A Thoughtful Parent's Guide, p. 81: "In 1984 at least 20,000 cases of invasive disease occurred in the US, with approximately 12,000 of these resulting in meningitis (the others in cellulitis, epiglottitis, etc.). These rates are the highest ever recorded. it is important to note that the disease has increased at least fourfold since 1946. Approximately 85% of all cases of invasive Hib occur in children under five years old, its being very unusual in infants under six months old, especially those that are breast fed. ..In the absence of prompt and effective medical treatment, the disease has a high mortality rate of up to 5%, as well as a high rate of seizures and other complications of the nervous system, up to 30%. Neurological complications include hearing loss, language delay or problems, learning disabilities, retardation, seizure disorders, and vision problems. Other complications include pneumonia, pericarditis, abscesses, septic arthritis, cellulitis, bacteremia, and epiglottitis."

Dr. Paul Thomas, The Vaccine Friendly Plan, p. 125: "Physicians my age and older remember too well the hospitals full of children with meningitis, the airway emergencies with epiglottitis and the miracle that the Hib vaccine was when it was introduced in 1985. We saw this disease virtually disappear in a few short years. The unknown is whether these serious illnesses would return if we stopped this vaccine. I suspect they would, as the bacteria are alive and well in the noses of adults and older children today. ..

Postvaccine follow-up studies have shown a 71% decrease in Hib disease in under-five year olds from 1989 to 1991, and an 82% decrease in Hib meningits between 1985 and 1991.This vaccine alone is believed to have prevented more than ten thousand cases of meningitis. In 2011 in the US, there were only 14 cases of serious Hib diseases a year, and feweer than 250 non-type B or unknown types of Hib invasive disease respectively.

As I mentioned in the introduction, this vaccine was introduced during my training in the late 1980s, and we saw an immediate significant drop in the numbers of children with meningitis and serious Hib infections like epiglottitis and sepsis. A child with suspected epiglottitis who was often drooling and unable to swallow would be rushed to the OR,, where X-rays were taken and the airway stablilized by intubation (a breathing tube placed down your trachea to protect your airway). Once a weekly occurrence, epiglottitis is a condition basically unfamiliar to younger doctors who have trained since the vaccine was introduced. Had you walked the floors of Valley Med Center or Fresno Children's HOspital before then, you would have seen several young children with severe meningitis, many of whom would not be neurologically normal if they survived the infection. These are infections of the past, a testament to a successful vaccine."

Plotkin and Mortimer, Vaccines, second edition, p. 337 et seq., "Before the widespread use of effective vaccines in young infants, invasive Hib disease was the leading cause of bacterial meningitis in the US and most parts of the world...Over the past 50 years, the advent of many effective antibiotics for Hib focused attention on treatment rather than prevention of disease. The appreciation that the morbidity and mortality of disease could never be completely eliminated by treatment, even with antibiotics, gave further impetus to the development of Hib vaccines."

Mark Blaxill and Dan Olmsted, Vaccines 2.0, p. 150 et seq.: "Virginia pediatrician Elizabeth Mumper, who is a supporter of the vaccine, vividly recalls seeing previously healthy infants before the vaccine became available whose spinal fluid was filled with pus. ..Since it targets only one microbe, it appears to work well enough."

Dr. Robert Sears, The Vaccine Book, p. 5, "A severe case presents with symptoms of meningitis, pneumonia, or epiglottitis immediately apparent to a physician. Hospitalization with aggressive antibiotic treatment and possible respiratory support in an ICU will ensure. Most children respond gradually and do recover fully but may spend many days or weeks in the hospital. Complications of Hib meningitis such as hearing loss, learning problems, or nerve injury, occur in about 25% of survivors. The fatality rate is 5% and typically occurs only if the disease is so overwhelming right away that treatment isn't adequate or the disease isn't suspected soon enough, causing a delay in testing and treatment. Fortunately such cases are uncommon. Hib blood, bone, and lung infections, though less serious, are still potentially fatal.

Is Hib common? No, but it used to be. Before the vaccine came into use in the mid-1980s, there were about 20,000 cases of serious Hib infections each year in the US. Now we have only about 25 cases each year in young children. "

I believe that each of these authors, some with personal experience treating Hib infections in the '80s, is telling the truth about it to the best of his or her ability. HIb meningiits is a dangerous disease and it was not uncommon in the years right before the vaccine was introduced (it wasn't widely given as a series until 1990). The vaccine for it is usually effective in preventing it, and was viewed as a miracle when it suddenly and dramatically wiped out Hib meningitis in a couple of years. The vaccine has dangers, such as an increase in diabetes and peanut allergy, as well as other possible reactions. The best way to protect a child under two is by breastfeeding and keeping him or her out of daycare. If he is not breastfed until two, he does stand a small chance of getting Hib meningitis, since the germs continue to be carried by most people. Even with antibiotic treatment, 5% of children with it die, and 25% are permanently damaged by the disease. Refusing other vaccines like the DTaP and MMR might reduce his chances of getting HIb meningitis, but at this time that's just a good theory: it has not been studied in practice. The homeopathic nosode would probably work to prevent it, but I don't have specific information on that. If a mother cannot or does not want to breastfeed for that long, I think she has a difficult decision to make, with dangers on both sides of the issue to get or refuse the vax.

I do not believe that vaccine manufacturers made up the numbers of those getting, dying, and being disabled by the disease before the vaccine, and I don't believe that they're making up the disappearance of the disease post-vaccine. The vaccine does pose dangers, but so does the disease, and everyone must think carefully about them.


Thanks for stealing my thunder David. But your explanation was more complete than mine.

Vaccines are a stupid and dangerous answer to a question only a lunatic would think to ask.

david m burd

I've reviewed the literature for ten years, most importantly the Military Surgeon Generals' Reports of the 1918-1920 citing a great number of novel, very toxic pus-generated vaccines mandated for ALL the millions military personnel (total reached 4.7 million by November, 1918, the majority ushered into duty during 1918. When so many troops became quickly terminally ill, the panic spread to the American public who also insisted on getting tens of millions of the new deadly vaccines. Contrary to perceived propaganda, the vast majority of 1918-19 deaths came from "toxemias" and "septicemias" (.i.e. blood poisoning) in both military and civilian groups - CAUSED by extremely toxic vaccines. By the way, this explains the great "puzzle" of always healthiest age group of 18-28 years old dying from "flu" - the only time in history (BECAUSE of the great percentage of that age injected with the vaccines).
ciaparker (and All) note: this may be a duplicate, sorry)

The H1N1 variant you cited was concocted about 15 years ago from dug-up remains in Alaska, and in fact meant nothing - except yet another fear-mongering medical myth - and falsely reinforcing the myth of a lethal Spanish Flu in 1918-19. Just like today, the CDC just makes it up as they go along, and by far the majority of 2009 H1N1 fatalities ascribed to flu were logically caused by a CDC-generated insane panic coercing two additional of the whipped-up H1N1 doses in October and November of flu vaccines having a full 25 micrograms of ethymercury, ON TOP OF THE EARLIER July, August, September doses already injected.

The Great Spanish Flu was caused by vaccines -- it's that simple, and that evident.


Death rates from meningitis after the vaccine continued the same downward trend as before the vaccine.

Hib no longer got blamed though.

I don't understand what is so hard to get about this.

Vaccines don't and can't work. Simple.

They could never work and there is no such thing as contagion so they wouldn't even be answering the right question.


The Spanish Flu was neither Spanish nor the flu.

It affected primarily healthy young adults particular soldiers.

And its defining symptoms were consistent with those of a cytokine storm.

In short, it was caused by the vaccines they gave to soldiers. Because there was a mass surplus if them at the end of the war they handed them out to everybody stupid enough to believe their propaganda about soldiers returning with horrible diseases.

Well they did have such diseases but mostly because of their vaccine program.


"One in 200 babies used to get a clinical case of Hib meningitis. "

I am not doubting your sincerity, but I wonder about that stat. Not that it didn't happen at all, but I don't remember seeing so much meningitis. One in 100 sounds very inflated.



You are mistaken. I recognize that breastfed babies and children are much less likely than those who are not to get serious disease (less likely, not totally safe), those who eat healthy organic food are also less likely. But look at all the people out there. Most couples both work full-time: they don't have much time or money, they can't afford organic, and don't have time to cook much. They eat out a lot, and eat fast food a lot. They put their children in daycare. They don't breastfeed them more than a month or two at most. So what are we going to do? We can't tell them, well, just quit your job, stay home with your baby, give him only organic fruits, vegetables, oils, and meats when he's weaned.

Children in daycare are at much higher risk than those kept at home of getting many of the VPDs. I was lucky. I didn't have to work outside the home and was able to breastfeed my baby until self-weaning (five and a half!) I got organic food and cooked a lot of homemade nutritious food. She was not in daycare. She caught pertussis at a La Leche League meeting at the Newman Center when she was eight months old: there were probably twenty babies and toddlers there, so there you go, daycare-like situation for two hours, and she gets pertussis. I caught strep throat at a play group when she was four, she didn't get it.

So what are we going to recommend? I'd like to see large trials of homeopathic nosodes to see how well they work. That would be my first choice. But in the meantime, would we want to go back to a thousand babies a year dying of Hib meningitis if no one vaxxed for it? Parent's choice, always, but many parents would want to protect their children from Hib and pneumococcal meningitis with vaccines. One in 200 babies used to get a clinical case of Hib meningitis. At this time one in forty gets autism, but it would be less than that if no one got the hep-B vaccine or the MMR for their children, less still if they didn't get the pertussis vaccine or the flu vaccine. So what if we were looking at one in 200 gets a serious case of Hib meningitis, and one in 400 gets autism from the reduced number of shots? Which should you prefer, which way should you go?



The H1N1 flu pandemic fizzled out and was not nearly as severe as they were predicting. But in part it was because of the Spanish flu in 1918-9. It was the first H1N1 flu on record, and, like all new diseases, it was terrible and very deadly, killing millions of people very quickly. New diseases will appear in the future, and at that time we would probably be grateful for any vaccine which appeared effective against it. But I read that every single person anywhere in the world alive in 1918 emerged with antibodies against that flu, whether they'd had a clinical case or not. And that immunity was passed down as nonspecific immunity, and the H1 and the N1 were recycled in different flus, so that another H1N1 flu in 1956, the Hong Kong flu, wasn't nearly as bad as the Spanish flu because everyone had at least some protection from it. And that's what happened in 2009: everyone in the world had some nonspecific immunity to H1N1 because of our collective experience with it. I'd say that it's better to get flu the natural way and get immunity to it the hard way, and it will give partial immunity when the flu components appear in new combinations. That's my preference and I've never gotten a flu vaccine, had several bad cases of flu. But if a flu as bad as the Spanish flu appeared at this time, I'd probably compromise my principles and get the vaccine for it. Or maybe I'd just go with the homeopathic nosode for it, I'd have to decide at that time. But wouldn't it be better to say that either the diseases or the vaccines can be very deadly?

But it's definitely not the case that natural diseases are always better than the vaccines. Yellow fever was horrendous and killed a huge percentage of those who got it, and they died horribly, in immense pain. Diphtheria was terrible, choking babies to death. Polio was terrible, striking fast and hard, making healthy children suddenly collapse on the floor, never to walk again. Tetanus was terrible: my father saw a man brought in to his father, a doctor, with tetanus in the '30s. The man was wrenched by convulsions and in a lot of pain. And he died of it. Clinical meningitis is terrible, also striking fast and hard and killing quickly. I think we need to let everyone know the facts to the best of our ability to provide them, certainly the risk of autism etc., and then let them make their choice. The polio, tetanus, and meningitis vaccines are usually very effective. I'm not positive about the diphtheria vaccine, although it seemed to stop the epidemic in Russia when it was widely given. The yellow fever vaccine is very dangerous in itself, I think you'd have to consider the rate of yellow fever in the place where you were going to try to make a wise decision.



Yes, I know that many neurological and autoimmune conditions are caused by vaccines. The facts must be given to parents and they must be allowed to choose. But before the Hib vaccine, just thirty years ago, a thousand babies a year in the US died from Hib meningitis. 5,000 babies a year were permanently damaged by the disease. Now it's close to zero on both counts because of the Hib vaccine. That's a lot of deaths and a lot of disability. You have to tell parents about the one in fifty with peanut allergy now, caused by the Hib vaccine. And a lot of other information too, there have been many adverse reactions to the vaccine. But what if the parent says he'd rather take the chance of asthma etc. and reduce or eliminate the risk of Hib meningitis? It is his or her right to do so, and the vaccine would probably reduce or eliminate the risk.


Yes, I'm aware that giving the pertussis vaccine depresses immune function. That's why they used to suspend DPT vaccination during polio outbreaks, as it was well known that children who had gotten the DPT in the previous month were much more likely to get a crippling case of polio. The pertussis vaccine also caused the rate of Hib meningitis to quadruple between 1940 and 1967, again, because it depressed immune function. But if your town is experiencing an outbreak of polio and a number of people have been crippled by it, it makes sense to get the polio vaccine. And it makes sense to not get the pertussis vaccine at that time (or even better, ever). How does this make it a bad idea to get the polio vaccine during an outbreak? I would not recommend getting it now, not unless polio came back, there's no use borrowing trouble, but if it came back here and now I would seriously consider getting it for myself and my daughter.

Cynthia, I have said dozens of times that I am against mandates, and demand parental choice. But I disagree with the proposition that no one should ever get any vaccine ever. Everyone must research it for himself and make the choice that seems best to him. There is no 100% correct choice in this. I think the chickenpox vaccine was a terrible idea. But at the same time, fifty children and fifty adults a year used to die of chickenpox. It's a point to consider. Personally, I wouldn't take the vaccine because of that, but some people probably would. it used to be that 450 children a year died of measles, out of four million cases. I would say that's not enough deaths to base your decision on, considering how relatively mild it is for most and how beneficial. But some people probably would want their children to get the vaccine based on that number of deaths. I hope that homeopathic nosodes work out to be as effective as they may prove to be. But at this time, I don't have much information on most of them. I think it's very important to remember that we're talking about deaths either way, death from diseases if you don't vaccinate and death or disability from vaccines if you do. It's not like everyone would be so healthy that no one ever died of communicable disease in a post-vaccine world. For my family I"d say that I'm willing to take the risk of the VPDs and not the risk of the vaccines (from personal experience). But I can't and wouldn't want to speak for everyone.


I told you ciaparker.

They used to blame all (well 90 per cent) of meningitis cases on Hib. Now they blame it on some other bacteria but the meningitis continues unabated.

That should be obvious because we keep on having to add one meningitis vaccine to the schedule after another.

Of all the cases, the meningitis renaming is the most blatantly obvious of them all. (particularly scroll down to Greg Beattie's article) shows this in finer detail.

Deaths due to meningitis have fallen since the vaccine but the trend was already way down before the vaccine.

The vaccine has been completely useless at preventing meningitis. Doctors simply refuse to countenance the possibility that the child's meningitis could have been caused by Hib because the child received the vaccine.

And rates of paralysis have increased since the polio vaccine. That is very clear in developing countries and still true in developed countries. It seems a bit odd to say that there is no way they could have been hiding all these paralysis cases. They aren't. They say it is GBS or multiple sclerosis or transverse myelitis etc.

I just don't get why it is so hard to understand this.

Doctors believe in vaccines so they simply refuse to diagnose the condition if the patient is vaccinated.

There is no need for a conspiracy. If you are prepared to accept that doctors refuse to blame vaccines for the child being injured straight after - and they do - it seems remarkable to claim that they would never ever refuse to diagnose a condition that the patient was vaccinated for.


Cia - your information is deceptively incomplete. When you "argue" your point, you always seem to talk as if

1. you believe that every person carries the same risk for meningitis or other diseases as the next person and that
2. vaccines are the only easy and/or plausible and/or effective way to mitigate disease risk and reduce the severity of symptoms and that
3. all vaccine adverse risks have already been discovered and defined and that there isn't any undefined science out there any more when it comes to risk from vaccines vs risk of the disease.

Which is why your arguments lack the credibility that they could have. They are so incomplete as to be circular in logic. Any fully informed consent will not only list the true risks of vaccines and diseases (an accomplishment that still lies far in the future) but will also inform consumers of the role of proper nutrition in mitigating not just disease, but vaccine reactions, because it is extremely likely that the same people at risk for exhibiting the most serious symptoms or death from vaccines are the same folks who may also exhibit more serious symptoms from the diseases themselves. When you go on and on about how diseases have ruined people's lives, you never seem to mention general societal trends going on in nutrition at the time statistics were or are at their worst.

For instance, grains (as a cheap, profitable food substitute for unattainable meats, vegetables, grass fed dairy and fruit) and sugar crept into diets of modern man, and indeed probably helped relieve some starvation. But the tradeoff was a dearth in nutrients and a resulting deleterious effect on the ability of the immune system to cope with illness from ANY source, leading to more death and disease and the rise of vaccines. There was not enough knowledge of nutrition, nutrient dense foods, fat soluble vitamins, or methods to communicate it to the public masses, and not enough compassion for industry to want to spread the word about non-patentable solutions to disease. What little knowledge of nutritional options there was would have been up against the commercialization and marketing of allopathic medicine to the masses during the late 19th and early 20th centuries - heavily backed by the industrialists. Industrialists had a choice: market vaccines to 100% of the population (a huge target market) or make medicines to help the sick (a much smaller market in the beginning, but promising with patent laws profit potential under control). Turns out they ended up with both markets: that first target market having now affected and grown the second market into a much larger one that is still growing today, given that over 50% of children now have a chronic illness diagnosis.

BUT we now know how important chemical free living, combined with nutrient dense vegetables, grain free (or anti-nutrient reduced grains) diets incorporating grass fed healthy meats and healthy fats are for health and the immune system. The science is in and is huge and growing and immediately available. It is a viable option to vaccines. So you CANNOT compare death and disability rates from 75 or 100 years ago, or even 25 years ago to support your hypothetical fear about what would happen today if vaccines were discontinued, given the comprehensive nutritional and probiotic knowledge and scientifically backed alternative solutions we have now which were not available back then. The game has changed.

If you continue to ignore the evolution of food and nutritional science in your arguments and you run the risk of becoming irrelevant.

Hans Litten

Posted by: ciaparker | November 28, 2016 at 09:56 PM

“There is a great deal of evidence to prove that immunization of children does more harm than good.” – Dr. J. Anthony Morris, Former Chief Vaccine Control Officer, US FDA
“The only safe vaccine is one that is never used.” – Dr. James A. Shannon, MD, Former Director, National Institutes of Health (1955-1968)
“The incidence of asthma has been found to be five times more common in vaccinated children.” – The Lancet, 1994. [6]

I know children with asthma , I know children with allergies , I know children with autism , I know children who are deaf (mmr) , I know children with scoliosis (mmr) , I know children with diabetes .
I see children wearing glasses in numbers that were never there before .
I know children with Crohns - They are all sick . Its the vaccines .
And this was not the way it used to be . And we only had a vaccine or two and as it turns out the BCG doesn't even work (so even that was unnecessary !) . And all the children were healthy , a few had lazy eyes I remember (and we now know that is Pb lead contamination through the water systems).

Last year the UK acknowledged 20,000 more seniors died that winter than expected on previous years . That is the flu vaccine (Betrand Russell's demise pill) . All the old folk are taking it - I know because I am asking them . A vaccine that no informed person can ever defend and the doctors continue on regardless . Gardasil is complete 100% lie and no matter how much evidence piles up , nothing is going to stop them it seems (until we do , and its all over , and maybe then we can get the untethered out there on the BBC and people will finally understand what has been going on) .

Its all vaccines Cia !

Hans Litten

Posted by: ciaparker | November 28, 2016 at 09:56 PM

We are in the middle of a diabetes pandemic (you allude to it yourself HIB)
Cancer pandemic
Autism pandemic
Obesity pandemic
Alzheimers \ dementia pandemic
MS is rife
and so on .

All of it documented to be caused by vaccination , and I see you already know that .
Vaccination is a complete fraud . A gigantic lie . And completely indefensible .
A technology that is being used for malice and nothing to do with healthcare ,


I disagree with you. There have been many terrible diseases in the history of humanity (or of living things), which have caused a lot of death and disability for millions of years. Being basically healthy and well-nourished is not going to save everyone from all of them. I don't believe that everything we read about disease is made up by pharma companies, nor that the numbers of children who have died of HIb meningitis were all invented by vaccine salesmen. It is a valid question whether or not to get the vaccine for any individual child, but I don't think it is valid to deny that Hib, pneumococcal, and meningococcal meningitis killed people in the past and continue to kill people now. It's valid to talk about the damage caused by all these vaccines, but I think it's disrespectful to those who died or were disabled by polio, meningitis, and the other diseases to deny that they were harmed by the diseases. The question is more complex than "No disease is that big a deal, while all vaccines are useless, ineffective, and dangerous." Well, they are all dangerous, but it comes down to whether you think the danger presented by the disease is worse. In some cases, it is.

What do you think made the rate of HIb meningitis drop from 20,000 clinical cases a year to 25 or fewer? Do you think that the medical establishment is so corrupt that these 20,000 cases continue to occur, killing 5% of the children, but the labs resolutely chalk them up to SIDS in every case?

I do not believe this. I do not believe that the number of children crippled or killed by polio continued in the same numbers, but was diagnosed as something else. Tens of thousands a year permanently crippled by Guillain-Barré syndrome? Families saying Well, good thing we know it's not polio, because this non-epidemic that is sweeping through our city is doing just as much damage as polio ever did?

It would be valid to say that the meningitis germs are around everyone all the time, in most people's respiratory tracts all the time without causing disease. You could say it's better to let everyone get immunity naturally, better for the community. You could say that when Hib meningitis germs were taken out by the vaccine, pneumococcal meningitis germs (more dangerous) moved in the fill the gap, and that when THEY were taken out by Prevnar, meningococcal germs moved in to take THEIR place (more dangerous still). But ultimately, if you take away the choice of the vaccine from everyone, you're saying that you think it's better for a certain number of children to die than for anyone to get the vaccine. And that's what the mandaters say, that it's better for X number of children to be killed or disabled by vaccines than to let anyone escape being vaxxed. I think it's better to fight for vaccine choice, and complete and honest information for all. I would be uncomfortable telling someone No, you can't get X vaccine for your child, because I say that he'll be better off without it. And then the child dies of measles or Hib meningitis, as some would.

I don't think the state has a right to either mandate or withhold the vaccines: it's up to parents to decide where they think their child's best interests lie. But to understand the concept of new germs filling the gap created by the vaccine's taking out one pathogen from the community, or that by just living you eventually get a subclinical case of all the local strains of meningitis and get permanent immunity to them, you have to accept that the pathogens exist and that they can cause serious disease. Denying the existence of serious diseases and denying that the vaccines usually work for some period of time to prevent the diseases in those who get them (while causing other disorders), creates a religion which very few are going to believe or accept. I know I'm not.


At this time, there are about 25 hospitalizations a year for Hib meningitis, with about five deaths, or less. So what made the incidence drop from 20,000 thirty years ago to 25 now? I think it's obvious that it's been the use of the vaccine.


Or, just more fabricated statistics.

From the same people who would have us believe that there is no autism epidemic. Kids like ours were always there. The perception of an epidemic is really nothing more than a recently evolved, laser-like ability of doctors to spot them.

In my experience, people who lie about one thing.... usually lie about everything.


ciaparker, what would it take for you to accept that the entire so-called success of vaccines is nothing more than a self-fulfilling prophecy?

You have been given quotes from the CDC instructing doctors not to diagnose these diseases if the patient is vaccinated.

You have been given non-circular data (such as total rates of paralysis vs polio, or total rates of liver cancer vs Hep B or total rates of congenital defects vs rubella).

That right there is pretty much definitive proof.

But there actually *is* definitive proof. It is possible to prove logically that vaccines cannot possibly work.

Viruses infect us chronically (at least that is what mainstream medicine tells us).

Chronic infection means that harbouring the virus makes us vulnerable to it.

But the very definition of immunity is that harbouring the virus makes us invulnerable to said virus.

So harbouring the virus makes us simultaneously *vulnerable* and *invulnerable* to the virus!

That is clearly a logical impossibility (well clear to anybody who isn't being deliberately obtuse) so we can conclude that vaccines cannot possibly work.

They cannot work in the same way that 2+ 2 cannot = 5.


I disagree that there are no vaccine-preventable diseases. There are a number of VPDs: all of them have killed at least some, and many of them have killed many. The question in very case is whether you believe your child is more at risk from the vaccine or the disease. I agree that in most cases he is more at risk from the vaccine, but you can only know that in hindsight. I am against the Hib meningitis vaccine: it has caused a lot of death and vaccine injury, almost single-handedly created the peanut allergy epidemic. It would be better for prevention to NOT get the pertussis vaccine, to breast feed until at least two years of age and to keep the child out of daycare. But a lot of kids have already gotten or will get the pertussis vaccine, and not many babies are breast fed for that long, and many have to go to daycare for one reason or another. So it's necessary to at least look at how dangerous Hib meningitis had become by the time the vaccine was introduced in the late '80s.

In 1987, there were 20,000 serious cases of Hib meningitis in the US every year. It had, and has, about a 5% fatality rate, and in about 25% of the cases there is permanent damage, such as hearing problems, learning disability, or nerve injury. The pathogen can also cause blood, bone, and lung infections which can be deadly. Antibiotics, if started early enough in the infection, can usually treat it, but not always. At this time, there are about 25 hospitalizations a year for Hib meningitis, with about five deaths, or less. So what made the incidence drop from 20,000 thirty years ago to 25 now? I think it's obvious that it's been the use of the vaccine. Although the vaccine IS dangerous, it has also prevented a lot of infant deaths from Hib meningitis. So it MUST be left up to the parent to decide whether or not he/she wants the vaccine for his/her child. I would refuse it, but actually I DID let Cecily get three Hibs. I said no to the fourth when I read that it could cause diabetes. Knowing what I know now, I would have said no to all of them. But she did not have an obvious reaction to it, and does not have peanut allergy. Also did not get Hib meningitis.

In the UK, Dr. Halvorsen says there were 1,000 children under five who used to get invasive Hib meningitis every year. Of these, 900 made a complete recovery, but 35 died, and 70 were permanently disabled by it. The chance of a child under five getting a serious case of the disease (nearly everyone gets at least a subclinical case and permanent immunity by five) was one in 3500, the risk of dying of it one in 100,000, and of being disabled by it one in 50,000 a year. The risk was greatest between six and twelve months (the young infant being protected by placental immunity). Invasive cases had about half of them as bacterial meningitis, treatable by antibiotics: about 3% die. One -tenth of cases appear as epiglottitis, and 3-4% die if not treated quickly. Cellulitis occurs in 9% of Hib infections in young children. Blood poisoning in 7%: rare, but the most severe form, with one in seven dying. Pneumonia, bone and joint disorders occur in the other cases.

Half of those who died were already immunocompromised, as is also the case with deaths from pertussis or measles. The other half were healthy. Dr. Halvorsen reports that the vaccine did give some immunity to the disease, but not for as long as it was originally thought that it would. He says that while one study showed a 14% increase of diabetes in those who got the vaccine, it was possible it was just from chance. He said that there was an association with asthma, allergies, and Guillain-Barre syndrome.

So the bottom line is that it is, for most parents, a difficult decision. I think the vaccine usually works to prevent Hib meningitis in the critical first two years of life, as is seen in the steep decrease of clinical cases before and after the vaccine. Hib meningitis was causing a severe case inn one in 200 babies in the years right before the vaccine. The vaccine is very dangerous. I think it's important to recognize that many people have been severely affected, even killed by the disease, and then give everyone the information we have on both the vaccine and the alternatives, such as the homeopathic nosode. I don't have any information on how effective the nosode is. I don't think many people would believe that no one ever really suffered from Hib meningitis, so there's no need to even consider the vaccine for protection against it. I think extended breast feeding is the best solution, for those who can do it.

Stan K.

Putting aside for a second the fact that vaccines are all dangerous and worthless, the "greater good" argument is fundamentally that of a totalitarian socialist. It assumes that my personal sovereignty is subordinate to the collective.

No matter how one sees the risk-benefit analysis of some particular product, and no matter how many magical secondary social benefits one conjures up or "proves," it is completely and unequivocally up to me what products enter my body and the bodies of my children. There is no compromise.

Only a totalitarian would argue otherwise.

@Barry: I agree with the unfortunate reality that most won't budge until misfortune strikes close to home. However we must press on. There are always some who will listen, and the ranks of the aware only ever grow. And with the push for mandates and greater state intervention, we don't have the luxury of leaving them to an isolated fate.


Thank you, Cathy, for this really excellent article. I admire your patience!

Hans Litten

“There is a great deal of evidence to prove that immunization of children does more harm than good.” – Dr. J. Anthony Morris, Former Chief Vaccine Control Officer, US FDA

“The only safe vaccine is one that is never used.” – Dr. James A. Shannon, MD, Former Director, National Institutes of Health (1955-1968)

“The incidence of asthma has been found to be five times more common in vaccinated children.” – The Lancet, 1994. [6]

Denise Anderstrom Douglass

I have great respect for every one of you who commented, and for you, Cathy, for the stamina and resolve you consistently show. But after so long a road, I want to say thanks to Barry, whoever you are. That's it in a nutshell. Some people ("think they are just too good to be told anything") won't "get it" until it happens to them. It's really sad that many of us who have been walking this path for a long time have daily reminders that even the closest relatives of the autistic child, parent, and grandparent -- and I mean siblings of the parent, siblings and other adult children of the grandparent -- fall into the "too good to be told anything" category. Yes, good luck with your vaccines. And I will look forward to your Youtube link, Laura!


"Parents by the thousands are telling a very similar story about how vaccines have disabled their innocent infants." Well said Barry. Parents who have not experienced this horror are luckier than they can possibly imagine and I envy the fact that their children managed to escape the damage done to the ones like my son who wound up with severe autism!


But if we're not prepared to offer answers for serious cases of VPDs in the post-vaccine world, then we lose credibility and supporters, and once there were an epidemic in which even a few people died of the VPD, there would be a backlash and increased support for vaccines.


There is no such thing as a vaccine preventable disease. In fact I would argue that the belief in this lie, is exactly what brought each and every one of us into this mess!

We will never be taken serious by anyone. Until we, the parents of vaccine injured children, are prepared to accept that fundamental truth.


Some of the problems with the "greater good" argument:

1) Individuals matter too.

2) Our health authorities are sweeping vaccine risks under the rug and exagerating the risks of diseases, and thus cannot even say what is for the public good. How do the serious chronic immune and nervous system disorders compare with the risks of communicable diseases? 1 in 5 small children have seizures, one in 68 have autism, 1 in 6 have a developental disorder... Huge increases in autism, ADHD, bipolar, asthma, diabetes, food allergies , IBD...

3). Even IF our current vaccine program were the best of all possible worlds, shouldn't they be striving to better understand adverse reactions for the sake of prevention and treatment, instead of dismissing them as coincidence and leaving families on their own to figure out treatment options? What kind of science and medicine does this? So negligent.

Angus Files

We've all spent months years answering the trolls,and it gets to the point when you realise your not talking to humans but computerised answers.Various links can be found at ease on how to answer back to us vaccine dissenter's, ssssshame on us-ho,honest.

Though the brainwashing is to be admired the ones in power have it down to a fine art. I am just glad that we haven't had teLIEvision in the house now for 12 plus years. This was mainly due to our fears of what our Autistic son would pick up-and to date his worst behaviours come from pre-school cartoons etc,never mind what goes on in mainstream TV.Horse to water Cathy thanks for sharing.


Cynthia Cournoyer

If the DPT could have led to more meningitis cases between 1940 and 1967, then you must have read that the children recently vaccinated with the DPT were also made more susceptible to a case of polio in the 1950's.

With these annoying "co-factors" if you will, we cannot give the polio vaccine the credit you try so hard to give.

The cry for no mandates is very simple. Allow us to choose. Most anyone in the vaccine controversy parade will tell you, choosing is not eliminating. But you are correct, if given both sides in a fair and honest way, most parents would RUN from their pediatrician's office. They know that. And we know that. So when vaccine makers go out of business, maybe there would be more disease but there might not be more death. And we are pretty darn sure that autism and a whole host of other chronic illness would subside substantially!

Would people want vaccines when they see disease? Yes. Not due to any accurate education, but because they were taught vaccines = health. If this equation actually had any role in our public health, then where is the vaccine for scarlet fever, et al. and where are the scary deaths for all the diseases that do not have a vaccine? In this modern era, vaccines have become inoculation against a phantom idea of what might happen, as opposed to the days gone by when vaccines were thought to be the answer to an existing horrible epidemic. Not so anymore.

When there was a shortage of flu shot several years ago, people went without more often than not. Where were people dying in the street? Where were the horrible epidemics? That shortage did more to show people they were "fine" without it than anything our marching in the streets ever accomplished.

VPD's (vaccine-preventable-diseases), is a cute way of saying that the only diseases worth preventing are those for which we have a vaccine. This is a narrow view and it keeps people holding onto a culturally ingrained idea that is drilled into the psyche of every person on earth. That is, the only bad vaccine is the one still on the shelf and not injected into a person.

Jeannette Bishop

I might add good luck with your adult mandates (they've floated a couple and passed one in California already anyway, and there are non-legislated ways of coercing/tricking into agreeing to vaccination that we also hear about)...

Hundreds of vaccines in the works...

Millions of adults whose childhood vaccines can be argued to have worn off (if they get essentially 99.9999% compliance, kind of like they have in China, in children, and still have outbreaks, kind of like they do in China, then it will only be natural for them to blame and target adults for boosters, kind of like they are blaming 1-3% of children now)....

An industry used to mandated markets with no liability for injury from most of their vaccines (I expect they'll either change the NVICP to cover all adult vaccines or try to shoehorn more onto infants and children so injured adults can't sue either)...

With government agencies that will disease propagandize at least once, lately twice, every year and market vaccines with taxpayer funds and manipulated statistics without hesitation (Simpsonwood transcript, Dr. William Thompson's documentation)...

With easy-to-question-with-even-just-a-little-scrutiny mandates like hepatitis B for infants with significant risks and no theoretical benefit for most and like flu vaccines for all which appear in research to actually increase risk for other infections and new pandemic flu strains in coming years (there's no reason to think they won't try to mandate every new vaccine for someone)...

She may want to keep her right to choose for herself and her children instead of throwing it away to get others to sacrifice their health for those who think they are "the greater good" and for a false sense of SAFETY for most (hopefully soon to be few) of the rest of us.


I agree that vaccines should not be mandated for anyone. But we need to also prepare for preventing serious disease in the post-vaccine world. Good nutrition and hygiene do a lot, but will not prevent all disabling or fatal cases of VPDs. Illnesses spread by the respiratory route will continue to infect nearly all susceptible people. I would not prohibit vaccines, but would do everything possible to make sure that everyone is given accurate information about the risks and benefits. Over time, I think the manufacturers would stop making them as demand for them decreased. They certainly don't produce them from the goodness of their hearts.

But it's important to remember how serious and deadly/disabling diphtheria, polio, tetanus, and meningitis often were. I don't think diphtheria would come back here since it's a disease of poverty these days, but we should have a plan to protect people in poor communities either in the US or abroad. We've discussed polio here many times, but I continue to believe that the vaccine stopped the polio epidemics from permanently crippling, sometimes killing, tens of thousands of children. Tetanus never killed that many, but the germs continue to be everywhere, and the potential for infection continues to exist. We don't see it much now because virtually everyone has gotten the vaccine for it, and protection lasts at least forty years. But it's still often deadly when it occurs, even with the best of treatment. I think if no one got the pertussis vaccine, not much meningitis would occur, as it's the suppression of the immune system by the DPT which allowed the rate of invasive Hib meningitis to quadruple between 1940 and 1967 (the DPT being introduced in 1940). But when it occurs, Hib, pneumococcal, and meningococcal meningitis are extremely dangerous and often deadly.

I agree that we need to give up vaccines, but not by force, or we would be guilty of the same high-handed despotism the vaccine defenders use now. The vaccines usually work to prevent the targeted disease, the flu and pertussis vaccines being the big exceptions. No one would want to be guilty of a child's dying from measles, meningitis, etc., because the parent had been deprived of the option of vaccinating him for them. The current near-invisibility of the VPDs is in large part due to the vaccination program. Yes, I agree that the harm caused to millions of vaccine recipients is greater than the benefit of preventing these diseases, but that's on a population basis. On an individual basis it can always go either way, and many children are saved from dying of a VPD because they got the vax for it.

I read the book The Solution last year, by Kate Birch and Cilla Whatcott, and was very impressed by it. There are homeopathic nosodes available to prevent all the VPDs safely and effectively. They only recommend the nosodes for half the VPDs, but all are available if needed or wanted. And I disagree with them that it's good to prevent diseases like measles, mumps, and pertussis in those older than infants. They furnish statistics on studies conducted in South America in the case of several epidemics there, and on how effective the nosodes were at preventing diseases like meningitis, polio, and leptospirosis. Who knew that Cuba had a huge and often deadly epidemic of leptospirosis ten years ago? I knew there was a canine vaccine for it (which I wouldn't give to my dog), but didn't know until I read the book that it could infect humans.

But if we're not prepared to offer answers for serious cases of VPDs in the post-vaccine world, then we lose credibility and supporters, and once there were an epidemic in which even a few people died of the VPD, there would be a backlash and increased support for vaccines.

Laura Hayes

Greyone, and All,

Cynthia Cournoyer's book, "What About Immunizations? Exposing the Vaccine Philosophy", does an EXCELLENT job of explaining that when each person does what is best for herself and her family, THAT is how excellent community and public health is achieved, not to mention individual health. Her book is a great one to share with people who are new to questioning the vaccine lies.


You never know what will wake people up from their conventional thinking. Keep trying. Try not to inflame the argument. Listen to what they say. Respond patiently.


Parents by the thousands are telling a very similar story, about how vaccines have disabled their innocent infants. And parents who have not yet experienced this horror, are responding with rage ..... towards the parents who are trying to get this truth out to them???

I used to think that most people are basically good, and that truths like this one are just too much for them to face. And while I still believe that to an extent, I also believe that some people are just too good to be told anything.

If these parents want to deny what we're trying to tell them, and risk coming to this misery through their own personal experience, then so be it.


A paradigm change for public health measures is needed, shifting from "the greater good" to what's good for each and every human being: clean air, clean food, clean water; identifying, minimizing, and eliminating toxins.

Laura Hayes

In reality, vaccines should never have come to market, for too many reasons to list here...and they most certainly should not still be in use today.

I look forward to sharing the presentation I gave 2 weeks ago at WAPF's Wise Traditions Conference, in which I cover why vaccines have no business being given to anyone, and much more. I am awaiting the DVD copy of my presentation, which I will then turn into a YouTube link...hopefully this week!

Keep on speaking up and out, Cathy, as it is our best method of getting the truth out there. What people do with that truth is up to them. You can't teach those who don't want to learn. Thank goodness there are those who do have the ears to hear, the mind to understand, the heart to care, the fortitude to say no, and for some, the willingness to join the fight to end the Vaccine Holocaust.

And if those in positions to protect public health, paid by our tax dollars, truly cared about the health of U.S. citizens, they would immediately ban the many, many products which are currently in use, poisoning us and all that we need to survive, that never should have been approved. For but a few: vaccines; toxic pesticides and herbicides; GMOs in our food supply; CAFOs; fluoride added to the water; flame retardants used on consumer products; toxic cleaners; processed chemicals sold as "food"; artificial sweeteners; Hg-laden light bulbs; the list is unfortunately endless. Such a terrible irony, that in a country which has numerous billion-dollar agencies charged with protecting public health, they have done the exact opposite. The health of Americans has never been worse.

Matthew Plache, Wolfeboro, NH

I have a lot of trouble accepting the argument that all children must be vaccinated in the interest of the "greater good.” It seems ethically insupportable to expect some children to "take it in the chin” for the supposed good of the rest of us. Yet that is the concept underlying the vaccine injury compensation program. Do we really want to be the sort of nation that sacrifices any number of children for the "greater good?” This is similar to what goes on in the post-apocalyptic nation of Panem in the dystopian world of The Hunger Games. The sacrifice of 25 children each year for the “greater good.” But that was fiction... right?


You never know what will wake people up from their conventional thinking. Keep trying. Try not to inflame the argument. Listen to what they say. Respond patiently.

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