VAXXED Presents Alabama Whistleblower: Anthrax Vax
Weekly Wrap: Bait and Switch

Vaccine Injury Community Seeks Identity of CDC Employee Who Used Rude Gesture

UPDATE:  The person whose name has been bandied about is NOT the person in the photo. We have confirmation of this. Please put down the pitchforks before someone puts an eye out.  His rude gesture isn't appreciated by any of us. It's puerile at best. Obnoxious too.  I suppose his fight or flight kicked in and he chose.... finger.  Protests trigger anger all around.  We are a community near the brink in many ways. 

Onward with our mission. The real culprits are safely ensconced in corner offices.

Comments

ATSC

Michelle: "We see it as something that needs to be done to protect everyone".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXOOBqINC_s


Linda1

You know what I think. I think some people with a sinking, proven sociopathic perspective, are looking for a life raft and a new strategy right about now. An ABA therapist who sees no correlation between autism and the MMR? Nothing in the literature?

"Many AVers think autism is just as bad as death, and those AVers are the most hated."

A therapist who works with autistic children wrote this?

"If you talk to many pro-vaxers, we don't want vaccines to harm anyone. Which is why many of us fight for vaccines. It's not just our kids, family, etc - we see it as something that needs to be done to protect everyone."

I could reference the troll playbook which instructs to tell emotional anecdotes about loved ones who were harmed from not vaccinating. That, plus the rest of it, makes little sense.

Benedetta

Ohhhhh, and a more detail account of those spiders in the CDC - with more insight in what the CDC thinks about us all.

http://globalfreedommovement.org/the-biggest-medical-whistleblower-event-in-history-just-happened/

Benedetta

Michelle:

I really already made my run a couple of days after that super full moon and dropped that pumpkin full of spiders on the CDC and now there are spiders everywhere! Snort, snicker

https://www.organicconsumers.org/news/spider-bites-cdc

And you are not upset about this?

Bayareamom

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULoybud2VNM

Barb Fisher discusses recent CDC language/proposition regarding new measures/guidelines re disease control/travel. Have to say, this was a brilliant commentary. Up until today, my husband had stated that all the CDC was doing was codifying the language w/in the regulations; that the CDC was already quarantining/pulling folks when traveling if it was suspected certain travelers may be harboring infectious disease(s).

He was absolutely correct in some measure, but woefully missed the mark as to the full breadth and scope of this issue.

I hope everyone takes the time to view this commentary. And then SHARE please...

Linda1

Michelle,
First of all, there was no violence. Let's not exaggerate.
Second, I'm very sorry for what happened to your sister. I know of someone who lost their child to meningitis and is now coping with that loss by working for meningitis vaccine mandates - even though the vaccine has never been shown to actually work (the manufacturer states in the insert that meningitis is so rare that it is impossible to know efficacy) and the manufacturer states that the incidence of serious adverse effects will, according to their research, far out number natural cases. Makes absolutely no sense scientifically or ethically. Only makes sense to Wall Street, and the mother who is acting out of grief and probably anger and who needs to do something with those emotions.

Let me ask you this: If your sister had suffered transverse myelitis from vaccination that left her a paraplegic, would you still be fighting for mandatory vaccination? How about if she died from Gardasil? Would you be campaigning to force that vaccine on young people? Mind you, even though the Japanese government withdrew their recommendation for the HPV vaccine in 2013, with only a reported 1 or 2% of their eligible population taking it now, our scientists are testing the vaccine on infants. In America, where the NIH holds the patent (and reaps the profits), it's full speed ahead. We have the most aggressive vaccine schedule and the highest infant mortality rate of all developed countries. Nothing to brag about. We should be looking at what we're doing wrong and yet, nothing about this in the presidential debates. Nothing about that fact that our babies are dying and our mothers too.

If your healthy baby died suddenly, hours after a round of vaccines at 2 or 4 or 6 months of age, knowing that the research clearly shows that infants become apneic and bradycardic within 3 days of vaccination requiring mechanical ventilation, would you think your baby's death was a coincidence? Would you be bringing your other children in for the same treatment? Would you want to be forced to give them the same treatment that killed their sibling?

Have you seen Vaxxed?

Benedetta

Good Lord! Michelle:

For the past 35 years I have had to listen to a bunch of guys tell me about their disaster with some disease. I don't know about some disease harming and causing lingering problems, but I sure can't say the same for no vaccine injuries in this family . Tons of them - we are up to our eyeballs in them. Don't say because we got saved by the grace of the vaccine - cause they did not have a vaccine for measles, mumps, rubella, chicken pox, Hep b, Hib, flu, rotaroter what ever when we were growing up. .

And when I tell the tale in detail that leaves no doubt my two kids, my husband and extended family did have vaccine injuries; no one has said that is terrible, I am sorry,

Vaccine reactions are not rare.

You know what; I grew some caster bean plant, pumpkins, and some broom corn in my garden this summer.. During the super full moon I made a broom, gathered my caster beans, and picked out a pumpkin. The one I chose - when I turned it over had a big black widow nesting under it in the hollow of the stem. That makes the fourth one I have found this year. I guess because it has been kind of dry. None of those usual big black and yellow garden spiders are around this year. Yeap it is a strange year.


I am going to take those spiky caster beans and put it in that pumpkin along with that black widow. I am gong to harness that 35 years of abuse and the anger that has built up because of it and that will be more than enough power to get that broom off the ground.

I am going to bomb CDC on Halloween night with that pumpkin on my broom - How about that for being violent.

Tell me where you live and I will try to fly over and signal you that we all are about love and let us all just get along as they mandate and actually sneak Pertussis vaccine into the tetanus shot and never say a word.

Religious provaxxers - with syrup dripping from their lips and finger tips and the threat of mandates might force us to release the Flying monkeys. That is what usual happens when people are not listened to and have to put up with your nonsense.

Jeannette Bishop

Hi Michelle,

I'm not very interested in your respect and am certainly less deserving of respect IMO than the (as far as I'm aware) non-violent and courageous protestors (if not all 100% perfect at proselyting) at the CDC a couple of weeks ago who are working to bring about real vaccine safety research in U.S. health institutions and to fight for protections of right to informed consent for everyone.

I AM sorry to hear that you lost your sister so early, and I AM also interested in/concerned about the level of understanding you might have of some current vaccine related events/trends:

1) the revelations by Dr. William Thompson that the CDC hid significant findings (and destroyed documents) of an MMR link to autism (the subject of the documentary Vaxxed) who is currently being blocked by the CDC director from testifying in the Tennessee court (because testimony by the major data analyst of the CDC's MMR timing paper "would not substantially promote the objectives of CDC or HHS.")

2) awareness of earlier obscured findings (and again illegally destroyed datasets) by the CDC regarding links to thimerosal exposure and autism/various other NDs (subject of the book Evidence of Harm, well-summarized in the film Trace Amounts)

3) the current push for stricter mandates on both children and adults (if you haven't received the MMR since the early 90s you're probably considered unvaccinated by some "pro-vaxxers") as the industry (used to mandated liability free markets) is set to roll out hundreds of new vaccines

4) the current whistleblower case against Merck for falsify efficacy data of the mumps portion of MMR

5) the existence of the NVICP (national vaccine injury compensation program) which requires the injured to first petition for compensation before exercising their "right" to sue in court

6) the concept of "herd immunity" applies to groups contracting disease naturally and as vaccine immunity is more transient outbreaks will and do happen in 100% vaccinated groups

Many vaccines aren't designed to prevent transmission, so justifying a blanket mandate for vaccines generally in the name of protecting the vulnerable doesn't make sense scientifically (and ignores all the vaccine injured and the right to avoid being among them, or the right to simply choose what path your personal healthcare will be) and some vaccines also create conditions that are potentially harmful for the immune-compromised (live viral vaccines like the MMR potentially shedding being one, a pertussis vaccines that allows recipients to be contagious without symptoms is another).

Vaccines are not studied as rigorously as other pharmaceuticals. They are not tested against true placebos or a fully unvaccinated control group to determine all adverse effects. They are not followed up for longterm adverse effects (the "anti-science" "anti-vaccine" "side" are usually the ones calling for a vaccinated vs. never-vaccinated all health outcomes study). And, as I mentioned above, if a vaccine is added to the U.S. "recommended" childhood schedule you cannot sue the industry or administrator if you are harmed without first going through the NVICP, so the industry has little incentive to make safe or effective vaccines (indeed there is perverse incentives in selling more doses when a vaccine fails, as seen with current mumps outbreaks, and in selling more pharmaceuticals to treat many adverse vaccine effects).

IMO there are people here with many degrees of pro- and anti-vaccine viewpoints. If current trends from some of calling anyone an "anti-vaxxer" who might want to refuse one or more of the current or upcoming vaccinations, or who simply wants to talk about all vaccine effects and limitations realistically, it may become uncomfortable for you to align with the "pro-vaxxer" agenda in the future:

http://www.immunizeforgood.com/vaccines/new-vaccines-on-the-horizon

(Sorry, the more I proof-read the longer this gets so I'm stopping with what's here.)

I would recommend at the very least getting informed about what is going on with mandates in your state and the groups opposing them and sign up to protect your rights and wish you and your family well.

Michelle

Hello Hera - you are a very nice person - EXACTLY the kind of AVer that is worth listening to, and respecting. We need more like you. I think, as autism parents, we see each other by our agendas, rather than a group of autism parents, that just want to do right by their children. I have 2 autistic sons, both born autistic. Both were severe, but now one is mildly affected. My youngest is still quite severe.

Of course I would never give the cold shoulder to someone who lost a child. What I struggle with are the people who try to correlate autism with the MMR. In university (research & dev psychology) and my career in IBI as a therapist, I have found no link in any literature, anywhere. But that's beside the point.

I'd say the majority of my feelings about mandatory vaccination stem from what happened to my sister. She was immuno-suppressed. In the 80s, vaccines were not really a big thing, its importance was not frequently visited. My sister caught so many vaccine preventable diseases, and suffered. Had she not had her second bout of measles, with encephalitis, there is a chance she could have lived. I don't want to see others who are immuno-compromised die b/c some people are scared off. Many AVers think autism is just as bad as death, and those AVers are the most hated.

If you talk to many pro-vaxers, we don't want vaccines to harm anyone. Which is why many of us fight for vaccines. It's not just our kids, family, etc - we see it as something that needs to be done to protect everyone. All and all, I think AVers and PVers really have the best intentions. But I find being violent at the CDC is not a good idea. Imagine if PVers had a protest against the Vaxxed bus and became violent...I don't think that'll help any of us parents in the long run.

Anyway - thank you, Hera. You are the type of AVer I deeply respect.

Hera for Michelle

Hi Michelle,
i am glad that you are trying to find ways to respect those who have different opinions from you. I too have many friends with different political , religious and medical views from me, and that is fine.

Given that you have given people here feedback about how you see them, it might be helpful for you to understand how at least imo, you come across.
I am pretty sure you are a decent person who is kind and respectful to your friends/

I also think that casual cruelty and bullying of vaccine safety advocates has become so widespread and socially acceptable that most people don't even realize they are doing it.

You stated that you don't want to hear "emotional anecdotes' You seem a nice person, so my guess is that in no other situation would you say to a parent of a dead or injured child
" I don't want to hear your emotional anecdote"
I am pretty sure you would at least say
"Wow, I'm sorry your kid had a stroke" or "I am so sorry you had to bury your baby."

You mentioned how important freedom of choice is to you. Me too. Yet people here are fighting for your right to make medical choices for yourself and your children. Even if right now, you want every possible vaccine for yourself, and your child, there may be in the future, one or more of the 100 or so vaccines in the pipeline that you don't want to get. Who knows; maybe you or child will have a reaction that you don't want to repeat with siblings. But in California, you have already lost the right to an education for your child if you decline. And rights for adults to make their own medical choices for vaccines are already being whittled down. One of my friends doesn't care about vaccines one way or another. He has never had a reaction to any of them. But he sure cares about freedom to make medical choices for himself. If you are sure that no one is going to tell you what to do , then you may wish to join us in protecting your medical rights.

Michelle

Hans, you're the type of person most vaxers roll their eyes at and don't respect. You may not be a respectful person, but happily, I've met anti-vaxers who are decent human beings. No one tells me what I can, or cannot do. Until my last breath, I'm never going to 'stay out' of it, or anything else. Your inability to be decent makes me sad - you're the type of AVer no one listens to.

To all other AVers, mutual respect, though having conflicting agendas, is something many pro-vaxers want. But right now, I see/hear so much hatred and bullying from your belief groups. Take what you will from this message, I mean no harm, and i hope one day, our two groups will learn to peacefully agree to disagree.

Jeannette Bishop

Ginger Taylor @ http://adventuresinautism.blogspot.com shares info about a letter and announcement coming out of the CDC:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carey-gillam/spider-bites-cdc-ethics-c_b_12525012.html

https://usrtk.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/CDC_SPIDER_Letter-1.pdf

https://www.regulations.gov/docket?D=CDC-2016-0094

Bayareamom

"... As I remember it, the protester first asked the man a reasonable question, politely. He said, "Go away." She asked another question, but he kept saying,"Go away."

Precisely why she should have stopped, disengaged and moved on.

Grace Green

I'm afraid most people here haven't watched the full video on Periscope. As I remember it, the protester first asked the man a reasonable question, politely. He said, "Go away." She asked another question, but he kept saying,"Go away." To me, he was being confrontational first. He could have said he wasn't interested, or something more cowardly like, "Sorry, I've got a train to catch." I think these people who came out of the CDC knew there was a protest going on and were looking for trouble. I've since heard that the protesters were attacked with chemtrails and the protest broken up early. How confrontational is that? Some people of this parish need to open their eyes, and wake up!

Hans Litten

Posted by: Michelle | October 17, 2016 at 08:19 PM

If I gave you a very small piece of paper and asked you to write everything down you know about vaccines and autism I suspect you wouldn't be able to fill a corner of it .

So stay out of it .

To everyone else get as angry as you like .
If you aren't angry about state sponsored Hg-enocide, then you are an idiot .

Michelle

You will never gain understanding, a platform, or respect 'protesting' what you want in that manner. You behave like idiots, and that's all you'll be seen as. I'm not on your 'side', but I can tell you, behaving like savage beasts out to feed isn't going to get yourselves anywhere, and you only give fodder to people like me to laugh at. Do you all want to be taken seriously? Then I strongly suggest you debate with facts (not emotional anecdotes), and do so in a peaceful and level-headed manner, otherwise the CDC won't hear you, the public won't take you seriously, and pro-vax people such as myself will never respect you. I am friends who think their kids were vaccine damaged, I don't challenge them, but I know if I were to ask them, they would patiently explain things to me respectfully, and same goes the other way. But if my friends were to act like you guys have, we wouldn't be friends. Respect yourselves and others, then you'll get respect.

Benedetta

Bay area Mom:
Nope I don't see it that way.
By the time you drive a thousand miles, pay for it all to stand outside the CDC - and it is for a limited time only you can stay -cause you got responsibilities at home - take from miners, factory workers, steel workers and gays demanding a cure; their play book . That play book says to make them wish you never came and will never come again. Make it miserable all you can.

The woman thought he was an employee of the CDC - and I will give all the credit that she did know.

LOL Those little CDC guards; are just trying to make a living too now aren't they. Yet, they had to come down to cross walk and stand there nervously as the Nation of Islam marched by. Now those poor guards don't have nothing to do with vaccines - they are low on the pole to aren't they?

That was just darn impolite of the Nation of Islam to get them all nervous.

Bayareamom

"The solution is to loudly tell everyone what you have seen vaccines do. I personally don't think protests at the CDC, or anywhere else, will accomplish much. I think writing or distributing books and articles, and commenting online, are the most effective means of changing the discourse. That way people read the material and think about it in private, not when put on the spot in a confrontation. And just plain civil disobedience. Refuse to do it, refuse the vaccines you will not take, and tell everyone within earshot why you are refusing. That's not confrontational when it's protecting yourself against vaccine assault, and most people can see that. "

Completely agree. Well stated.

Bayareamom

"With all due respect BAM . This so called authority , the CDC is behind the mass poisoning of children all around the world . They have know all along what they are doing .
In fact the program is accelerating in its intensity."

With all due respect, where's the line in the sand, then? Would it have been acceptable to you to torch this guy, string him up, spit in his face? Where's the line drawn?

Look, not every single person working for (or at) the CDC is a ruthless, evil person who deserves to be lynched. Not everyone who works for the CDC works in the Immunization Branch. There are clerks, secretaries, janitors, etc., who work there, too.

Do you realize how hypocritical you sound when you put up articles on this blog about the bullying of your children, but yet somehow excuse this same type of bullying on your end during protests (or any other venue)?

If this man had deliberately gone up to this mum and taunted her with epithets, that's one thing. But even then I would hope that SHE would have had the common sense and decency to not allow that type behavior to escalate into something more horrific.

Look, there are plenty of people who may have seen the protestors and would have been interested in approaching you for more info. I just heard on a periscope that one woman was driving by, saw the protestors, slammed on her breaks, and got out to engage. Turns out she lost her baby to vaccines, but assumed she was the only one out there who felt that vaccines caused her baby's death.

When protesting, you are never going to reach every single person who sees you w/your message. Be realistic. Protesting will hopefully garner much needed attention to our cause, but please - never expect that protesting is ever going to win over too many people. Protestors frighten people at times, and some, like my husband, just want to be left alone when having to cross over, or come near to, those who are protesting. Some people just are not comfortable having something right in their faces; its best to reach out to them in other ways if you want them to understand your message.

Example: Long story short, I found a video pop up on my feed on YouTube. I had no idea that some families were documenting their lives fully - on YouTube. So I started watching some of these families, just out of sheer curiosity, because they have small children/babies.

And of course, they're vaccinating the crap out of their little ones. One of these families is Mormon. They went the IVF route and now have quads. They live in Utah. I've reached out to them twice about the vaccine issue; sent them well documented research info. on the subject.

Been politely rebuffed by them twice now. Unfortunately, I am now witnessing with their quads what I was hoping I wouldn't witness. Three of the daughters are clearly speech delayed. They'll soon be two years old (December); one is speaking a few words, the others - nothing at all. Also, two of them appear with that sort of dead look in their eyes, the sort of look Stephanie Cave speaks about in one of her books.

It's heartbreaking to witness. These parents have said they were so frightened for their girls' health that they are absolutely following all protocols given to them by their pediatrician. I can't even watch their vlog any longer. It just sickens me.

I also found a gossip forum (quite by accident) which gossips about these YT families. Sure enough, there's one about this quad family. Just yesterday, I finally found my mark and went for it. Put up a long comment about our son's vaccine injuries and described in a nutshell what we've learned about this subject since our son's reactions.

You wouldn't believe the comments I've garnered. I've mentioned the movie Vaxxed twice now; told them where to download the live-stream and/or to buy the DVD. I've got one nurse engaging me and another young mom who disagrees (she's got preemies and had them selectively vaccinated).

I can tell you that NONE of these folks would have been reached by protests in the street. What works for many people are the sorts of communication one can have with them in a more closed environment. You're not really in anyone's face and you can stay somewhat private when communicating.

It's just my personal feeling, but I have never felt that protesting really gains anything PRODUCTIVE. I do see, and fully understand, the gathering of spirits and the support everyone feels when things are done in a group setting. That's important; I've no issue with that. But understand that protesting, at least w/this type of issue, when you don't have millions in the streets, is only going to get you so far.

Someone like Anthony Fauci is not going to look outside his window, look at the protestors, and realize he's got to change his tune.

What really caused me to almost fall off my chair was something that Josh Coleman said (of Vaxxed team) and Dr. Brian Hooker said, during his Vaxxed bus interview. They were discussing what some of these people are like who are at the top of this thing.

Dr. Hooker mentioned that he's met Colleen Boyle. He said that she literally looked like she was medicated; that she behaved almost like an automaton. Josh then mentioned that Richard Pan's eyes almost looked as though there's nothing there, inside, when he was confronted by those who have vaccine damaged children.

Some of these folks may or may not be someone who has no conscience, have no empathy and no sympathy for those they've harmed. if that's the case, and I truly believe it is, then no amount of protesting is going to CHANGE things w/these people.

There is literature which discusses (by professionals in the field of psychology/psychiatry) which document the fact that many folks who are CEOs, public figures, etc., seem to carry sociopathic traits. It's difficult, at best, for those of us who do have empathy and the ability to 'feel' others' pain, to understand these type of individuals.

So try to understand what and WHO you are really dealing with, when you're out there protesting. If you really want SUPPORT for your cause, the last thing you need to be doing is getting in the face(s) of those of whom have NOTHING to do with this issue, or at least, not the ones who are machinating, covering up and committing fraud/malfeasance.

Those people doing those things are not stupid enough to walk outside and be confronted protestors. There are back door entries/exits they'll use, plus the CDC has an underground system they've avail themselves of, as well.

I think this Finger Man issue needs to die a sudden death. Let. It. Go. I hope our side of the fence learns something from this. Respect is a two way street. Or at least, it should be. Being respectful towards others of whom you would like to seek understanding with on this issue, will go much further for you re your cause, than the bullying route.

 ciaparker

Patricia,

I disagree about the legal route being the solution. All they have to say, and they do, is that no one has the right to endanger the lives of everyone else by refusing vaccines. Since they refuse to admit how often the vaccines disable or kill, that makes it like restaurant employees having to wash their hands before touching food. They have no right to refuse to wash their hands even if they say they don't see why they should have to wash their hands if they have no time or it dries their skin out. And then it's case closed.

The solution is to loudly tell everyone what you have seen vaccines do. I personally don't think protests at the CDC, or anywhere else, will accomplish much. I think writing or distributing books and articles, and commenting online, are the most effective means of changing the discourse. That way people read the material and think about it in private, not when put on the spot in a confrontation. And just plain civil disobedience. Refuse to do it, refuse the vaccines you will not take, and tell everyone within earshot why you are refusing. That's not confrontational when it's protecting yourself against vaccine assault, and most people can see that.

Hans Litten

Posted by: Bayareamom | October 17, 2016 at 11:17 AM

With all due respect BAM . This so called authority , the CDC is behind the mass poisoning of children all around the world . They have know all along what they are doing .
In fact the program is accelerating in its intensity .

How can anything this woman protestor did ever be wrong ? against a backdrop of Hg-enocide .

Bayareamom

I have a friend from my past whose husband acquired a hospital infection, MRSA, when in the hospital for surgery. He'd fallen off the roof of their home, broke a leg and chipped a piece off his spine. He was told he would need back surgery which would require at the minimum, a three day stay.

The surgery went fine; post surgery did not. My friend's husband nearly died from his hospital acquired infection. MRSA. His stay in the hospital lasted for eight weeks; he left the hospital only because their insurance had run out.

My friend now serves on a public state health committee regarding MRSA. She's worked hard, along with other advocates, to try to get legislation passed which will ultimately, hopefully, change various hospital procedures and regulations regarding this horrible infection, which now kills more patients yearly than AIDS.

I found a few pictures of my friend taken of her when she was visiting the CDC. In one pic, she's standing right in front of what is apparently the CDC's front desk. She is standing alongside two other women, inside the CDC (CDC logo on the front desk is clearly visible in that picture). On each one of the women in the picture, is clearly what appears to be a Visitor badge. All three women were attending a CDC joint committee session regarding the MRSA situation.

I couldn't help but wonder what my friend would have thought if she and these others had been confronted by protestors when either entering or exiting the CDC. Would these protestors have simply assumed that simply because my friend and these others were entering/exiting the CDC meant they were employees of the CDC? Would that have been the assumption? Clearly, the CDC has visitors coming and going from its main campus on a daily basis. Not everyone entering or exiting that campus is an evil, nasty person who works for the CDC (much less for the Immunization Branch).

I have read several articles here at this blog about the bullying of autistic children (by their peers and adults). The stories are horrific and maddening.

...why is it that bullying is okay when it's coming from your side?

To be clear, I would have no issues should Anthony Fauci, Colleen Boyle, or some of the others at the top tier involved with this issue show their faces and willingly confront the protestors. But I'm speaking of the average Joe who may or may not have anything to do with this issue and is simply trying to go about his/her day and have to perhaps walk into the path(s) of these protestors.

I'm a pretty feisty person. When needed, I have lambasted a couple of my former bosses IPartners with law firms) who were shall we say deliberately making my work life miserable because of certain unethical business practices.

When the time was right, I confronted head on each one of these jerks. I mean I was in their faces, yelling. You could hear my voice (or so I was told) all the way down the hallway. Normally, I don't behave that way, but they deserved it. But I made my point with them and amazingly, things did change for the better after my confrontations with them. (My mistake was waiting too long before I confronted them. By the time I did, my temper got the best of me. While I'm not proud of my behavior to some degree, amazingly my willingness to stand up to them garnered me a decent show of support from them and my co-workers.)

So I DO understand anger and being pushed over the edge until you're ready to explode. But there's a time and a place for things. There's a time to engage and a time to pull back, especially when you may be in the path of someone who has absolutely nothing to do with the issues you're protesting against.

Protesting does not give you the right to trod all over someone else's right to be left alone. If Finger Man was deliberately taunting the protestors (I don't know, I wasn't there), then that's one thing. But if that route was the only route he had to choose from in order to get to where he wanted to be, then standing in front of him, as this mom certainly did, was just plain unacceptable.

The point of protesting is to garner attention to your cause; to help educate others who may not be aware of your issue. And certainly a part of that would be to garner SUPPORT for your cause. Isn't that what you want? So do you think you're going to get that support if you're in someone's face who clearly doesn't want to engage?

Bullying is bullying. Is' okay when you're doing it while protesting, but NOT okay when it's happening to your autistic child? C'mon.

Grace Green

Benedetta, I agree with your comment, and I have watched the whole video, too. I and my family have been treated with such aggression and contempt that I am sure they think we're the sort of people not to retaliate, or even defend ourselves. Everyone in society has a responsibility to listen to this issue. Only yesterday I was laughed at for telling someone I have evidence of genocide. Why would anyone laugh at that rather than asking for more information, unless they know it already?

Linda1

I can't tell you how disappointed I am that rally leadership and others thought this man's image should be published which is hurtful to him and his reputation. This man's behavior was deliberately taken out of context. Especially after what was done to Dr. Wakefield, we should know better. We are better than this.

Anne, Fox News isn't the only outlet missing the mark on the rally reporting.

Bayareamom

I didn't see at all that this man was walking during the middle of the protestors. What I saw (at least in the video that I watched) was a close up of this man and this woman. She was literally in his face. The camera was up close to the two of them. He then stupidly flips her the finger and stands there.

That's what I saw. I've viewed no other videos or different angles of this occurrence, anywhere else.

So IF this is what this man did, he's an idiot and then deserved to have someone in his face.

But if all he was doing was trying to cross the street and she's in his face, my last comment stands.

Hans Litten

Posted by: DFisher | October 16, 2016 at 11:17 PM

Yeah the protester was the aggressor . She deliberately poisoned her own child with a mercury and aluminium concoctions that has been decades in the making .
It doesn't matter what that person did , she was never the aggressor . The CDC are the mass murderers here - And the cdc is still trying to perfect the ultimate surreptitious kill.

Hans Litten

Posted by: Patricia | October 17, 2016 at 07:53 AM

I do agree with your point of view in part . Very happy the legal route is occurring .
But the legal challenges need backing on the ground too .

We MUST use every single available avenue & method to protest against these vaccine outrages .
We certainly cannot afford to limit ourselves in any way .

The criminal CDC has had it all there way for far too long .
This gentlemen's salute is a victory for us in my opinion (there is certainly no science demonstrating vaccine safety in that middle finger - I think it sums up the CDC's attitude to all the parents and all the science beautifully - the CDC are chemical poisoning thugs ).

Benedetta

I watched the video.

He walked down in the middle of protesters. And the woman did engage him. She showed him a picture and if you listen to her voice, she does start out friendly and informative.

Now I ask you - when you walk down in the middle of protesters and you are part of what they are protesting - do you expect silence. Your middle class, too good and too polite is showing.

You all should take some lessons form American Greeting Card workers (many years back) and coal miner and their families of how to protest.

You are not there to say - Look we are here. You are there to make that company - that government, that place of business, that CDC - to know you are there, to make them uncomfortable to skim the razor edge of what will put you in jail and what is your right - to stand and protest.


I would like to see some one - like middle management come walking in the middle of a picket line and come out with no more than he did and I would like to see what happened if he did anything other than say I am sorry, or Wow, or I did not know - but stick up his finger. Let him do that in the midst of that. He was a fool to do that and he took a chance. You guys can't see that?

If I was walking in the middle of protesters you think I would throw up my finger at anything they said or did? I am not stupid.

There is something wrong with that man.

Patricia

A protest is a protest is a protest....and that is fine and good and right and proper.. But it is not going to change anything. No amount of shouting and protesting will create change against an overwhelming force. The force of the establishment.

What WILL create change is going down the legal route. This real issue is about the right to informed choice. And that will be enough to bring down the whole house of cards - with 'herd immunity' written all over it.. It will allow people anonymously and ruthlessly to protest with their voices, but the quiet voice, the voice that says, thank you, but I choose not to. I have the right to do that.


Hans Litten

Posted by: Researching mom | October 16, 2016 at 11:22 AM


Could not agree more RM ! good point and good comment .
We need to protest every way we can .

Did you see Galway , and Margaret Stanley getting a good shoeing (great day indeed)

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/ireland-asked-to-attend-who-meeting-over-low-uptake-of-hpv-vaccine-1.2820866

Hans Litten

Why was this protest outside the cdc not widely advertised in advance ?

DFisher

From the video, it looks like the protester was the aggressor. I would have flipped her off too.

Benedetta

And some protesters had to bear it that one of the CDC women said "Get a job"

Well the protesters have a job - most of them - taking care of a disabled child.

I would have loved some one to have got in her face.

Benedetta

I am not sure you are right Bay area Mom.

Sorry. I know she was in his face and she made him mad, but she is mad herself .
She has a right to be mad.
Perhaps he will go back inside and tell them all what she had to say to him.
Hey, those guys out there are really angry. She got in my face- I gave her the bird though.

.
Remember how the Gays got the attention that was needed to fight AIDS. They were angry, rude, and in their face.

She came a long way to protest - she has been uncomfortable for a long time - so - she made some one at the CDC uncomfortable.

That I think might be protesting at it's finest.

Bayareamom

"...She has EVERY RIGHT to protest. EVERY RIGHT to 'get in the face' of her aggressor. .."

She DOES have the right and privilege, to protest. She did NOT have the right to get in that man's face/space. He was not her aggressor. It was the other way around (and yes I did watch the video).

Further, I've been in this movement for over 23 years. I've run an online support group and worked for a brief time, as the California State Director for the National Vaccine Information Center. I worked my butt off during that interim, and have done so prior to having that Directorship, and after.

Poor behavior was exhibited by BOTH these two individuals. Further, it doesn't MATTER if this man is or is not, an employee of the CDC. He was a man who appeared to be trying to walk across the street and was confronted w/this woman during the process.

Also, this man most likely, even if a CDC employee, has no authority whatsoever to help this woman, or any of the other protestors on the curbside that day.

You can get your message out w/o resorting to bully like tactics. Call me Miss Manners or not, I call it like I see it. Finger man was crass and just plain rude and should have known better. In an ideal world, it would have been lovely to have seen him actively engage this woman and show an interest with what was going on.

Unfortunately, he didn't. His body language clearly conveyed he was uncomfortable when confronted with this woman. There is a time and a place to engage, and a time to know when to pull back. There have been plenty of individuals at prior protests, who showed an active interest in the goings on. A police woman, as an example, approached some of the protestors last year. She thanked the protestors and stated she had grandchildren she was concerned about.

Some people will show an active interest, some won't, and some will show absolute disdain for the cause. Learn to separate those of whom belong in each category, and deal with them accordingly. No bullying, no brow beating needs to happen. If someone isn't interested, be polite, don't engage and move on.

How can we teach our children to not be bullies if we cannot exhibit the appropriate behavior ourselves, no matter what the circumstances? NO excuses for bullying...ever.

Linda1

Researching Mom, DaWei,
You characterize this guy as her aggressor. He was not her aggressor. He was a man trying to cross the street.
Protesting is good. But having a vaccine injured child does not give one license to demand the attention of anyone on the street or anywhere else. In fact, this video could be used against us. It clearly does not portray us in a good light.

Jeannette Bishop

I really can't focus on the topic of this post. I can't focus on the picture above particularly--I guess that even though lately I have to work very hard not to repeatedly consign in thought some people to a place I don't like being preoccupied with, I'm still, somewhat happily, hypersensitive about some obscene and maybe not so important things--but I can't believe the CDC is a wonderful place to work for anyone not capable of maintaining a powerful but slightly off-reality paradigm, and/or not lacking in a fundamental ability to have compassion. I just hope these people, if CDC employees, seek understanding of what's behind the protests, and I guess the same if not CDC employees.

The following I can't not focus somewhat on (even if I might be offensive in pointing it out):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cX7t-bzNeUE

I used to be fascinated as a kid watching jet trails left behind in a rather bright blue sky and wondering why, unlike clouds, they faded so fast, ironically, a little disappointed that they did.

Researching mom

I find it interesting that some discuss his actions without having watched the video. Watch the video before you comment!

And this type of protest is waking up the world. I bet you can remember the protestor at Tianinmen Square! If you don't think protests are valid, then what are YOU doing that is making a large impact? A comment on social media that is seen by a few friends? How do you think that is going to change anything?

DaWei

People on here putting down the protesters and saying to leave the man alone. What is a protest? Seriously, what are the objectives but to get attention in order to press for changes? Are you aware of the draconian 'Stop and detain' measures the CDC has proposed for itself? The mother shown has a vaccine injured child who is injured because of work done IN the CDC complex. She has EVERY RIGHT to protest. EVERY RIGHT to 'get in the face' of her aggressor. If the man in the photo was headed into the CDC complex or coming out of it, he is affiliated with the CDC. Please do not demean people's efforts who are doing something for YOU (whether you acknowledge it or not), while you sit at home and review your 'Miss Manners' checklist for protest etiquette. I'm sure protesting at the entrance to Auschwitz would have been something you found equally distasteful and disruptive to the workforce. Thank God for the people who went out and protested for our medical freedom!!! God bless them all!!!

Linda1

"He should have walked around the protestors and avoided this type of confrontation."

He tried to avoid her. There was no other way out to the street than to walk past her.

"...you cannot resort to some of the same sort of crass behavior we all complain about w/folks on the other side of the fence, and then resort to same, on our side."

Exactly right. We complain about being bullied. This guy was bullied, shown on our side's video that is now all over the internet.

Doug Troutman

This guy really looks professional. My tax money pays for this creep.

Bayareamom

"What does the person on the street owe a protestor? The video clearly shows this man trying to walk around the protestor and then when he's waiting for the light to change to cross the street, she gets in his face and demands his attention. Three times he quietly asks her to "go away" and she doesn't stop, doesn't respect his three requests. Finally, when she fails to engage him, she retaliates by telling him that she's going to take his picture. That's when the finger goes up and while I think it would have been better if he controlled himself and didn't respond to her provocation, I don't blame his reaction to it. She was clearly pushing his buttons.

The CDC has 15,000 employees. All of them do not work in the Immunization Safety Branch. We do not do our movement any favors when we are aggressive with people who just happen to be employees. If you want to get in DeStefano or Boyle's face, I have no problem with that. They deserve it. But this guy was just trying to cross the street. He had no obligation to talk to or listen to anyone."


THANK you for this. Completely agree. What little I saw when viewing that short video was all I needed to see. That woman, while 'attempting' to appear polite w/her protest, was clearly in this man's face. She was standing in his personal space and simply would not let up. While I did not note that he quietly asked her to stop, MY nerves would have been shot if I had been in his shoes.

This mom had absolutely no idea who this man was/is and EVEN if he was a CDC employee, this does not mean that he works in the Immunization Branch. And even if he did, it wouldn't mean he is someone who has any sort of authority re the scandal that is ongoing re Thompson, OR have had anything to do with the MMR fraudulent research issue.

When I told my husband about this event and what had transpired w/this man and this mom, he looked at me and said that she's lucky she didn't get in HIS face if that had been him. My husband's the type of guy that just wants to do his business and not be hassled by anyone trying to sell him something, whether it's Girl Scout cookies, a newspaper, or a petition to be signed. He wants to be left alone.

I feel the same way, although I tend to have a bit more tolerance for some of these folks than my husband. IF this man had actively engaged this mom and had asked for more information, THEN it would have been appropriate for her to stop and have a conversation.

But she was clearly in this man's personal space. Make no mistake, I am not condoning this man's rude behavior. He should have walked around the protestors and avoided this type of confrontation. On the other hand, I am not going to condone this woman's behavior, either. Of course I have empathy/sympathy for her re her child! But I'm not going to condone this type behavior; it does our movement absolutely no good and gains us NOTHING in the end.

I have never been overly fond of these type of protests anyway, most especially because they always seem to escalate into something such as what happened here. I understand people's emotions run high during these events, but you cannot resort to some of the same sort of crass behavior we all complain about w/folks on the other side of the fence, and then resort to same, on our side.


Susan

My son has autism so he has been my focus but my older daughter also has allergies and ADD. Just found her 3 month shot record card that the nurse filled in for me that I was supposed to keep up but didn't. It showed she indeed got all these at once at three months: DPT, polio, Hib, PVC
I guess it was because I told them she was going into daycare and they wanted to make sure she was "protected".
What a bunch of crap. That was when my healthy baby suddenly started getting sick all the friggin time and ear infections so bad her drum burst.
I remained clueless until 4 years later and her brother regressed into autism after his shots made him so sick.

What a fool I was.

Damn ignorance. Damn the deliberately closed-minded CDC and its culture that demeans every vaccine injured child and their grieving parents. How dare we question their insane "schedule" that subjects tiny infants to such risks before they can even eat solid food. Damn them.

Jeannette Bishop

I wish I was among the "dozens" protesting in body and spirit, instead of just in spirit. I really appreciate these reports though when they allow comments. Some are saying the protesters numbered in the hundreds. Of course there's at least one comment saying there are "hundreds" of studies "proving" vaccines are safe, not just by the CDC--he didn't reference any--but I was curious if the "Dozens" in the headline, instead of something like "A Handful," meant the showing was rather large.

http://www.11alive.com/news/dozens-protest-vaccinations-at-cdc-in-atlanta/336083503

British Autism Mother

@ Dan Burns. Thank you for the succinct explanation. Of course, in the USA, jaywalking pedestrians are social pariahs. Memo to self:- Always eliminate the mundane before considering alternatives.

Kathy

According to some CDC employees, they all wear badges while out and about. So, he is not a CDC employee. Further, this CDC employee told me that the rally protesters were blocking people's paths, including this guy's, accosting them verbally, preventing them from going to lunch. They may be charges filed against the rally sponsors.

go Trump

He looks like a somewhat younger version of someone from CHOPS.

The “frauds, felons and all their friends” at the CDC have done about 3 trillion in damage to the next American generation, not to mention what they have done to the rest of the world...

To them, the entire US economy should be based on a lifetime of drugs and selling insurance to each other. They now think Zika will kill those who are left..

As we all know, the American news media will cover only stories and events that promote themselves and secure funds in their own coffers.

The sh t .... hits the fan in a few weeks.

Linda1

What does the person on the street owe a protestor? The video clearly shows this man trying to walk around the protestor and then when he's waiting for the light to change to cross the street, she gets in his face and demands his attention. Three times he quietly asks her to "go away" and she doesn't stop, doesn't respect his three requests. Finally, when she fails to engage him, she retaliates by telling him that she's going to take his picture. That's when the finger goes up and while I think it would have been better if he controlled himself and didn't respond to her provocation, I don't blame his reaction to it. She was clearly pushing his buttons.

The CDC has 15,000 employees. All of them do not work in the Immunization Safety Branch. We do not do our movement any favors when we are aggressive with people who just happen to be employees. If you want to get in DeStefano or Boyle's face, I have no problem with that. They deserve it. But this guy was just trying to cross the street. He had no obligation to talk to or listen to anyone.

Dan Burns

He is waiting for the stoplight to change.

British Autism Mother

There's something that doesn't ring true about this man. One of the videos online shows him gesturing for a longer time than simple anger would normally express itself. It's almost as though he's deliberately making sure he's being photographed. Is he a bona fide employee of the CDC or is he either an actor or an agent provocateur? How are we being manipulated and why?

Jeannette Bishop

Coverage of the protest and inside a pediatrician's office:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRUs1Qs0Gbs

It's up to us

It's estimated that 4% of the U.S. population are sociopaths. It's obvious that that figure is much higher at the CDC.

Don't vote for Hillary

This employee is a disgrace but the liberal media will not pick up on it. They are immune to caring. That alone should tell people that Hillary should not get the vote from anyone impacted by or concerned about autism.

Benedetta

Oh for heaven sakes - move out of his way -- he has a job and a 60,000 dollar car to support.

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