Dachel Media Review: Katie Couric Bravely Confronts Gardasil Injury
Dachel Media Review: Autism GI, Couric

Unofficial Transcript Katie Couric on Gardasil Vaccine Injury

KatiebigKatie Couric interviewed Rosemary Mathis and Emily Tarsell.  Rosemary is President of SaneVax.org - devoted to informed vaccine/medical consent for the safety of all patients.  Our reader Bob Moffit created this unofficial transcript for us to share with you.   Our Anne Dachel shared in her News Review that TIME Magazine was quick to attack Couric for her willingness to air this story:


There is no "HPV Vaccine Controversy." At least, not when it comes to the injection's safety. And yet, that was the title of the lead segment on Katie Couric's daytime talk show, "Katie," this afternoon. The nearly half-hour story, which the program called their "Big Conversation," centered around two mothers who believe the vaccine for human papillomavirus (HPV) harmed their daughters.

Among the guests were Emily Tarsell, a mother who claims the death of her daughter, Christina, was caused by the HPV vaccine Gardasil in 2008. Another mother and daughter pair, Rosemary and Lauren Mathis, believe Lauren developed a bizarre illness characterized by nausea and fatigue due to the vaccine. Rosemary Mathis is now the director of the anti-HPV organization, SaneVax, Inc.

Tarsell and Mathis are understandably distraught mothers. But Couric is a journalist. . . .

The two HPV vaccines currently available, Gardasil and Cervarix, are both proven safe through clinical trials, independent studies, and post licensure monitoring. The CDC and FDA also continue to track the vaccines' safety.

And yet Couric has framed the issue as if there were a debate to be had about whether the HPV vaccines are good for the public's health. . .

Here is the unofficial transcript.

"I had my two daughters vaccinated and so did millions of other parents .. but .. some say the risks may outweigh the benefits. There are claims it could be dangerous in a handful of cases .. even deadly .. but .. nearly 80 million Americans have HPV and there are 14 million new cases reported every year. We want to keep our kids safe .. but .. is the vaccine the way to go? That's what we're asking as today's "Big Question".
VOICE-OVER:  Human Papilloma Virus is a sexually transmitted disease that's almost impossible to avoid.  According to the CDC, nearly all sexually active men and women will contract HPV at some point in their lives.  For most people, having HPV doesn't cause any health problems .. the virus has few outside signs or symptoms .. and .. 90% of HPV infections will go away within 2 years.  But the virus can also lay dormant for years or even decades before mutating into genital warts or causing 1 of 6 types of cancer .. the most common of which is cervical cancer .. a disease that claims the lives of 4,000 women a year in the U.S.  To combat the spread of HPV, the FDA approved two vaccines .. Gardasil and Cerverix.  Only Gardasil has been approved for boys by the CDC .. but .. both vaccines are recommended at the age of 11, with the hope of immunizing children before they become sexually active.  Gardasil is administered in a series of three shots, Cerverix in two.  While the FDA and CDC say the vaccines are safe, the Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP) reported there have been over 200 claims against HPV vaccines, including 11 families who believe it caused their child's death.  In June, 2008, twenty-one year old Kristina Tarsel from Spark's, Maryland, was found dead in her bedroom .. only a few weeks after being inoculated with Gardasil.  While the autopsy report listed Kristina's death as "undetermined" .. her mother Emily believes she knows what killed her daughter.
KATIE:  So, please welcome Kristina's mother, Emily Tarsel.  Thank you so much for being here.   First of all, I am so sorry about your daughter's death, just 21 years old.  Tell us a little bit about Kristina, Emily.
EMILY:  She had a great curiosity about life, she was an athlete and an artist .. and .. a philosopher.
KATIE:  Sounds like an outstanding person with obviously an incredibly bright future.  Did you all decide together she would get the HPV vaccine?

EMILY:  When she was 20, we went to see the GYN for the first visit.  The doctor was telling us that Gardasil would be safe and effective .. would prevent cervical cancer.
KATIE:  Let's talk about Kristina's experience .. I know that she had symptoms after each shot that was administered.  What were these symptoms?
EMILY:  Well, because we have a case pending, I cannot go into detail about what happened each time.  Umm, she was previously healthy, had no existing conditions .. umm .. she did begin to develop some things .. you know .. "Oh, I have a rash .. wonder what that's all about.  I feel dizzy".  And she reported this within a few days of her 3rd shot .. and .. within 18 days of the Gardasil shot .. she was found dead in her bed.
KATIE:  When was the last time you saw your daughter?
EMILY:  She was going back to Bard .. to be trained for a job that she'd have there on campus during the summer .. so .. I hugged her .. and .. I can still feel that embrace .. and .. I let her go .. and .. that was the last time I saw her.
KATIE:  You have, I know, filed a federal claim because Gardasil was approved by the FDA.  Why did you decide you were going to do that?
EMILY:  If you have reason to believe your daughter's died from a product that caused her death, you want to hold people accountable.
KATIE:  Well, we reached out to Merck, the manufacturer of Gardasil and in a statement .. the company defended the vaccine saying:
"Gardasil's safety was established in clinical trials involving more than 25,000 females and males .. they continued studying more than 500,000 people after more than a million doses had been administered."
"Parents should understand the extensive data supporting the safety profile of Gardasil and we encourage them to look to the CDC and FDA .. and .. the advice of their own physicians to make an "informed choice" about something as important as a vaccine to help prevent cervical cancer".
KATIE:  Dr. Diane Harper is a professor at the University of Louisville and an international expert on HPV and HPV prevention.  I know Dr. Harper, you are an integral part of the science of bringing the HPV vaccine into human trials.  So, why initially, did you think this was such a positive development for cancer prevention?
DR. HARPER:  I was very excited initially because I thought "yea, we have a vaccine".  this could be very important .. especially in countries that don't have any screening with it.  But, then I started looking at what isn't covered .. and .. I looked at the fact that Gardasil doesn't last long enough to prevent cervical cancer.  HPV infections are something women get throughout their lifetime. The other thing that looking through the CDC data .. as well as other published data .. is that HPV is most often sexually transmitted.  But, between the age of birth and 11 years of age .. 10 to 15% of these children are already infected with these virus types .. so, it isn't that you are completely negative until you are 11 years of age .. and then you're at risk .. so .. there's an underlying infection rate already there.
KATIE:  So, that makes it not being from sexual activity, it's just because they have the virus?
Dr. HARPER:  There's some kind of cutaneous transmission ... it's always skin to skin transmission and there's some kind of cutaneous transmission .. whether that's parental, whether that's babysitter, whether that's bath-tub .. we don't know.
KATIE:  So, are you saying that you would now .. not recommend girls or boys get the HPV vaccines?
DR. HARPER:  In the concept of cervical cancer prevention .. what I think is important for people to know .. Gardasil is an option .. but .. that's all it is.  It's an option .. and .. if you feel comfortable that you want to take the vaccine to prevent yourself from getting an infection for a certain amount of time, that is your right to do.  The benefit of taking Gardasil is that will happen.  But, as we heard .. there are also some harms associated with it.
KATIE:  In your expert opinion .. do the benefits outweigh the risks?
DR. HARPER:  We have PAP screening now .. in our new recommendations .. that just came out a couple of months ago .. that use HPV testing and (cytology?)
KATIE:  What is (cytology)?
DR. HARPER:  I'm sorry .. PAP smears .. when you go in and get those cells scraped off your cervix, we put those two tests together we have nearly 100% ability to find pre-cancers which can be treated at a 100% cure rate .. and .. they can detect cancers.   It is a much better PAP test than the one we had in the past, which could not detect cancers even if you get them.  So, at this point, what I think is most important for people to understand .. PAP screening is key.  PAP screening is key to all of this .. um .. if you get the vaccine, you still have to come in for PAP screening .. because of the other HPV types that could be causing changes on your cervix.
KATIE:  And, with boys .. boys can get a number of cancers if they have the HPV virus .. correct?
DR. HARPER:  The number of cancers boys can get are .. .anal cancer, head and neck cancer, penile cancer .. all three of those cancers occur in very low rates.  NIH defines these as rare illnesses .. the only exception to that is men who have sex with other men.  And, in that population .. the rate of anal cancer is just as high as the rate of cervical cancer before we had PAP testing.  But, in boys, again, we have the efficiency is no more .. the trials lasted three years .. so .. the long duration of protection if your vaccinating somebody at 13 may not last long enough.
KATIE:  I had no idea that it only lasted for five years.  I thought it was a lifetime protection .. knowing that PAP smears were still necessary, but, I didn't realize the efficacy basically wares off after 5 years.  So, when you hear about this Emily, when you hear Dr. Harper say these things, how does it make you feel?
EMILY:   Well, it is the reason I am here because its an outrage .. that's why you have to know and you have to take responsibility for finding out.
KATIE:  Well, Emily, thank you for coming and talking to us about this important topic .. about your daughter .. Kristina .. and I know it must be very painful for you to do that.  We appreciate your being here and telling us your story and her story .. and .. Dr. Harper .. thanks to you as well.
KATIE:  Up next .. a young woman who was so ill she was fighting for her life .. and .. her mother believes the HPV vaccine is to blame.
KATIE:  Today's big conversation is about the HPV vaccine.  Like Emily Tarsel, Rosemany Mathis of North Wilkesboro, North Carolina .. says she also wanted to protect her daughter Lauren from cervical cancer .. and .. followed her doctor's recommendation to have her daughter vaccinated .. but .. she now believes that decision nearly killed her daughter.
"When you are a mother you always try to do the right thing for your child.  You try to get them their vaccines .. and .. do the things your doctor tells you to do.
LAUREN:  Before 8th grade, the doctor convinced my mom to give me the Gardasil vaccine.   He said it was supposed to prevent cervical cancer.
ROSEMARY:  He highly encouraged me to get the vaccine .. even though we had no history of cervical cancer in our family.
LAUREN:  So I wound up getting all three shots .. and .. after each shot I got sick.  After the first two shots, I was sick for about a week each time.  After the third shot I got sick without getting better.
ROSEMARY:  She was nauseous and had severe headaches .. she couldn't get out of bed.
LAUREN:  There was a lot of pain involved, it's kinda like my whole body was just shutting down in different places.  I missed three years pretty much ... I didn't go to school and laying in bed is just like ......?  The lowest point was just sitting at home, staring at the wall, thinking that it might not get any better .. that I might not make it to see tomorrow .. or .. if I did make it to tomorrow .. I'll still be sitting staring at a wall.
ROSEMARY:  I actually slept with her during all this time .. because I was afraid .. I was truly frightened she was going to die in her sleep.
LAUREN:  My mom would just say .. I'm sorry for putting you through this .. cause I know it's my fault. But, it was never her fault.  I always had faith it would turn out well.
ROSEMARY:  I kept taking my daughter to the doctor every week and I felt like they were ignoring me.  We'd be going back and fourth .. back and fourth .. between doctors.  I didn't know how to help her .. but .. I tried my best to reach out .. figure out how to help her ... on the internet with other mothers and trying to figure out how they were treating the symptoms of their daughters.
No parent should ever have to go to their child .. to tell them they might die .. or that they may have a very severe outcome from a vaccine. Parent's shouldn't have to do that.
KATIE:  Welcome Rosemary and Lauren Mathis.  What an ordeal you both have been through.  Rosemary, I know that you were frustrated because you felt you were being ignored by the doctors when you had concerns about how Lauren was doing.  And then you finally get to a doctor at Duke.  What did that doctor tell you?
ROSEMARY:  The doctor looked through her records which were probably a foot tall ... all these medical records .. and .. he analyzed everything .. ran tests .. and .. he told me that she had a vaccine injury.
KATIE:  Now, when he said a vaccine injury, he wasn't specific about Gardasil .. but ..that's the conclusion you drew?
ROSEMARY:  No he was not, but, Gardasil was the only vaccine she had at that time.
KATIE:  Lauren, tell me what a typical day was like for you when you were going through this .. because I know .. I understand .. you were in a great deal of pain.
LAUREN:   A typical day was mostly spent in bed.  If I was able to get up and walk around, I was doing pretty good.  Due to the nausea and headaches .. the pain really came from .. a lot was my gall bladder had stopped functioning .. so that caused a great deal of pain.
KATIE:  What was it like for you to watch your daughter go through this?
ROSEMARY:  It was hard.  I felt like I had let my daughter down.  I let my guard down by letting her get the vaccine .. that I didn't do research because I trusted my doctor .. and .. my advice to parents is to go out and research this vaccine.
KATIE:  And, Dr. Harper, what do you think about what happened to Lauren.  Is this highly unusual?
DR. HARPER:   Well, its highly unusual in that, as Merck will tell you .. millions of young girls have had this and haven't had Lauren's reaction.  The point is you have to look at the benefit versus the harm.  What your benefit can be from this versus what any possible level of harm that you as a patient are willing to tolerate.
KATIE:  Rosemary, I know you and Norma Erickson, a journalist .. co-founded a website called "Sane.vax" .. and ... Norma's here today.  Norma, why was it important for you to set up the website?
NORMA;  Katie, it was important because, like Rosemary said .. she didn't know ay of these side effects .. she didn't know there were .. perhaps .. substantial risks.
KATIE:  And did you all take part in legal action in the aftermath of Lauren's experience Rosemary?

ROSEMARY:  No we didn't.  My goal was to help other mothers .. so we built the website to consolidate these stories .. but .. my main focus has been to help others understand what's happening.
KATIE:  'Well, Rosemary and Lauren, we really appreciated your time and sharing your story with us and also Norma .. thank you very much for being here.   Dr. Harper, again, thank you.
KATIE:  And, we're talking about the HPV vaccine today.  Dr. Malica Marshall is a pediatrician at Mass General Hospital in Boston .. Malica ..nice to see you .. welcome.
KATIE:  So .. we've heard some really tragic .. heartbreaking stories today about girls and the HPV vaccine.   What's your reaction to these stories?
MALICA:  I think we have to be careful not to jump to the conclusion that just because something happens soon after something else .. that one thing actually caused the other.   There have been independent doctors and scientists who have looked at all the data .. and .. there's been a lot of data over the past few years .. and .. they have come to the conclusion that the HPV vaccine doesn't seem to be any riskier than any of the other vaccines that we routinely use.
KATIE:  So, what is your recommendation for girls and boys?
MALICA:  The HPV vaccine has been approved for girls and women .. ages 9 through 26 .. but .. the CDC recommends that girls around the age of 11 to 13 get the series and that's because we want to get them before they become sexually active.
KATIE:  And for boys as well .. starting at age 11?
MALICA:  We think it's important for boys for two reasons .. it can prevent cancers in men as well .. like anal cancer, head and neck cancers.  It can help prevent genital warts which can be a real nuisance and very difficult to treat.  Also, by vaccinating boys .. you are helping prevent the further spread of HPV.  So, you are protecting society at large.
KATIE:  What are some of the common side effects you are seeing among your patient population?
MALICA:  We haven't seen .. to my knowledge .. any significant or serious side effects.  With any injection, you can get redness and pain at the injection site.  Some girls have developed low grade fevers .. and .. there have been reports of fainting.  Now as it turns-out .. teenagers and tweens often faint with injections and it doesn't look like they are fainting any more with the HPV than they do with other shots.
KATIE:  Let me ask you about some of the issues that have been raised today.  If 95%of HPV cases naturally clear-up on their own ... why would you need a vaccine to prevent it?
MALICA:  My understanding is that it can persist in 10 to 20% of people who contract it.  yes, most people clear it within a couple of years ... but .. there are people that continue to have it. We can't identify who is going to hold onto the virus and who is actually going to clear it.  So, 20 to 30 years down the road .. a woman might be faced with cervical cancer and we know that 12,000 American women deal with cervical cancer every year.  4,000 die . and .. we still have women who are dying from cervical cancer .. in this country ... despite the PAP smear screening .  We don't have a lot of treatments that can actually prevent cancer .. the HPV vaccine is one of the treatments we do have.
KATIE:  We have another mother and daughter here with us today .. from Basking Ridge, New Jersey.  
KATIE TO MOM:  Your daughter's pediatrician recommended that she get the HPV vaccine .. why did you decide that was the right thing to do?
MOM:  They gave me the information to tell me about the risks and what to expect .. the efficacy of the vaccine.  I just wanted to do a little of my own research .. and .. after doing that, I actually waited until my daughter was 14 years old just because I thought, since it was a relatively new vaccine, let me just take my time and I was confident at that time there wasn't any sense of urgency.  I wanted her to be a little bit older and also for her to feel comfortable with taking a vaccine .. such as ... Gardasil.
KATIE:  Evoni (daughter's name?) .. what was it like for you?  Did you feel comfortable with the whole notion of this?
EVONI:  I felt pretty confident about me being fine afterwards.  After the first round, I didn't display any side-effects .. so I was confident about the second ... the same with the third.
KATIE:  Mira (mom's name?)  ..  after hearing these stories today, do you have any second thoughts about what you did?
MIRA:  I did what I felt was best at the time .. based on the knowledge I had .. so I don't have any regrets.
KATIE:  We've obviously heard two different sides about the HPV vaccine .. and .. I think for parents watching .. it's probably still rather confusing ..when you hear these heart-breaking stories these families have endured.  So, the bottom line .. Dr Harper .. what would you say to parents listening to this conversation?
DR. HARPER:  I have a couple of pieces of advice.  One is to remember pediatricians are expert at giving vaccines, that's what they do, they're trained to give vaccines.  The pediatricians do not do PAP smears.  Be your own advocate, be comfortable in saying no .. it's not for you .. and .. you want to go with the PAP smear screening system.  The next piece of advice is to know the best gift you can give your daughter when she turns 21 .. give her a free certificate for a PAP smear .. and .. encourage her to continue with the PAP smear screening for the rest of her life.
KATIE:  And Malica .. what would be your advice as a pediatrician to parents watching?
MALICA:  I would encourage parents to do exactly as this mom did .. she did her own research .. she spoke to her pediatrician .. she spoke to family and friends .. and saw they had daughters who went through it and didn't have any adverse effects .. and .. I hope they will actually make the decision to vaccinate.


Sandy Lunoe

Perhaps what will be most remembered in connection with the Katie Couric show is the utter nastiness and cruelty of pro-vaxers towards those who were suffering and greiving because of HPV vaccine injuries.
Many of the nasty comments disappeared from the net but the original ones have been archived by many across the world. The comments quoted here include many by several of Dr Offit's foremost disciples:


I'd like to read a critique of Arnheim-Dahlstrom et al: http://www.bmj.com/content/347/bmj.f5906 This study is being widely cited as handing Katie Couric's hat to her (though Arnheim-Dahlstrom's close ties to pharmaceutical companies like Merck are not mentioned).

Cherry Sperlin Misra

Now that their vaccine is on the market and being given to thousands, I doubt very much if the manufacturers care if their vaccine is effective or not. They have an interesting bonus in the third world countries, that people in the west may not have thought of : You may know that cervical cancer is really a pretty rare cancer, but uneducated people here in India are easily told that this will prevent uterine cancer- which is fairly common ! Once again, high fives for Merck and GSK.




I know you all know this, but this is for anyone who might be confused and wondering if the trolls are telling the truth. How do we fight this? Quote the manufacturer. The trolls are making stuff up.

Here is some "Important Safety Information" for parents from the makers of Gardasil (caps, except for the name Gardasil, are my emphasis):


"ANYONE WHO IS ALLERGIC TO THE INGREDIENTS OF GARDASIL, including those severely allergic to yeast, SHOULD NOT RECEIVE THE VACCINE. GARDASIL is not for women who are pregnant.

The side effects include pain, swelling, itching, bruising, and redness at the injection site, headache, fever, nausea, dizziness, vomiting, and fainting. Fainting can happen after getting GARDASIL. Sometimes people who faint can fall and hurt themselves. For this reason, your child’s health care professional may ask to sit or lie down for 15 minutes after they get GARDASIL. SOME PEOPLE WHO FAINT MIGHT SHAKE OR BECOME STIFF. This may require evaluation or treatment by your child’s health care professional...

Here are some excerpts from the highlights of prescribing information for physicians:


"Because vaccinees may develop syncope, sometimes resulting in falling with injury, observation for 15 minutes after administration is recommended. SYNCOPE, SOMETIMES ASSOCIATED WITH TONIC-CLONIC MOVEMENTS AND OTHER SEIZURE-LIKE ACTIVITY, HAS BEEN REPORTED FOLLOWING VACCINATION WITH GARDASIL. When syncope is associated with TONIC-CLONIC MOVEMENTS, the activity is USUALLY transient and typically responds to RESTORING CEREBRAL PERFUSION by maintaining a supine or Trendelenburg position. (5.1...

GARDASIL is a sterile suspension for intramuscular administration. Each 0.5-mL dose contains approximately 20 mcg of HPV 6 L1 protein, 40 mcg of HPV 11 L1 protein, 40 mcg of HPV 16 L1 protein, and 20 mcg of HPV 18 L1 protein.
Each 0.5-mL dose of the vaccine contains approximately 225 mcg of aluminum (as Amorphous Aluminum Hydroxyphosphate Sulfate adjuvant), 9.56 mg of sodium chloride, 0.78 mg of L-histidine, 50 mcg of polysorbate 80, 35 mcg of sodium borate, <7 mcg yeast protein/dose, and water for injection.
The product does not contain a preservative or antibiotics.

12.1 Mechanism of Action

HPV only infects human beings. Animal studies with analogous animal papillomaviruses suggest that the efficacy of L1 VLP vaccines may involve the development of humoral immune responses. Human beings develop a humoral immune response to the vaccine, although THE EXACT MECHANISM OF PROTECTION IS UNKNOWN...

13.1 Carcinogenesis, Mutagenesis, Impairment of Fertility


Love that last line. They don't know if Gardasil is carcinogenic or genotoxic, but swearing up and down that it is completely safe, they want to give it to all youth now, to prevent uncommon and treatable conditions that might occur 20 to 40 years from now. Never mind that the vaccine might cause more cancer than the cancer they propose to prevent and never mind that they have no idea if the vaccine has the potential to cause genetic mutations in an entire generation of human beings. We KNOW how to detect and treat cervical cancer and we know the incidence is small in developed countries, but we don't know if the vaccine to prevent it will cause cancers in greater numbers that we might not be able to treat. Come to think of it, look at all the young girls with chronic illnesses who are begging for relief of their suffering after Gardasil.

And Merck says not to take the vaccine if you are allergic to any of the ingredients. Do doctors ask about this? Do they test for this? Do they discuss the ingredients with patients? When asked point blank if the vaccine is safe, Dr. Malica did not say anything about seizures, ingredients, allergenicity, carcinogenicity or genotoxicity.


"How's that for fabulous news? Utah's Southwest Department of Health has banned Gardasil."

That's actually not good news.

The official who made that recommendation clearly did not understand what it meant for FDA to "fast track" a product. It would be good news if someone who had a clue banned Gardasil, but that's not at all what happened here.

You should celebrate real victories, but you should probably ignore foolish mistakes, since celebrating foolish mistakes makes you look foolish.

Stay focused.


How do we fight this, you ask? By stressing that this is an issue of choice. If you oppose my right to choose, you are anti-family and anti-freedom.


Linda, but you'll notice there are only a few shills on the Katie site that are willing to put their Facebook account and real name to their views- obviously Gorski and Ken but not many.


The shills are dominating the discussion now. Fortunately and unfortunately, Katie Couric and staff are going to have some important insight into the forces that Jenny McCarthy and Andrew Wakefield have faced.


Well, in the words of Jim Carrey, Katie Couric isn't the problem. The problem is the problem.

Anne Schnedl

UT Dept of Public Health did not BAN Gardasil ... they made the decision to not recommend/offer, nor stock this particular vaccine. The decision was made primarily b/c of lack of demand (how about that, the free market at work).

Gardasil is still available in UT for anyone who wants it - they can obtain this vaccine through private physician offices.

Here's a link to a Salt Lake Trib article (with a somewhat misleading headline)


cia parker

I've posted this information on the dangers of Gardasil revealed by Merck's own testing in several places. I got it from Hilary Butler's book From One Prick to Another. It would be good if everyone reading this were to remember it for use in discussions about Gardasil. It causes MORE cancerous lesions in the vaxed than in the unvaxed, but of the at least twelve cancer-causing serotypes not included in the vaccine. It causes only a modest reduction in the number of women getting treatments for precancerous lesions, nothing like the 70% you'd expect if it prevented 70% of all cervical cancers. It showed no efficacy in preventing the most dangerous type of lesions. The study by Stobbe the shills are touting which showed a reduction in HPV infection states that the reduction is of the "targeted" strains of HPV, leaving out the increase in number of lesions caused by nontargeted serotypes expanding to fill the gap.
Sawaya PMID:17494933 “HPV vaccination: more questions, more answers” FUTURE II trial. Rates of grade 2 or 3 cervical intraepithelial neoplasia or adenocarcinoma in situ were 1.3 in vaccinated women and 1.5 in unvaccinated women, an efficacy of 17%. In analyses by lesion type, the efficacy appearws to be significant only for grade 2 cervical intraepithelial neoplasia; no efficacy was demonstrable for grade 3 cervical intraepithelial neoplasia or adenocarcinoma in situ. Merck claimed efficacy against high-grade lesions was around 100%, but in this trial it was only 17%. Against non-vaccine HPV types, Gardasil had a negative -23% efficacy, meaning the vaccine caused more people to develop CIN3 lesions to other HPV types, which is why the overall efficacy was so low. The trial involved 12,167 women with no HPV preexposure. Sawaya believed that the efficacy was so poor because the at least thirteen oncogenic HPV serotypes not included in the vaccine caused cancerous lesions in them. “Targeting only two types may not have had a great effect on overall rates of preinvasive lesions.” In the trial, there were 70 cases of non-HPV 16/18 cancerous lesions in the vaccinated women, but only 57 cases in the placebo group.
In Table 93 of the Merck data (STN 125126 Gardasil) to FDA on one of the trials, in the outcome for the CIN3/AIS column against the non-vaccine types, you see 33 cases in the vaccinated group and 25 cases in the unvaccinated group, which again gives a negative vaccine efficacy of -32%. That means 32% MORE people who were vaccinated got non-HPV CIN3 lesions than those who weren’t vaccinated.
Sawaya in the NEJM article More questions more answers cited above said that “in contrast to a plateau in the incidence of disease related to HPV types 16 and 18 (in the vaccine) among vaccinated women, the overall disease incidence regardless of HPV type continued to increase, raising the possibility that other oncogenic HPV types eventually filled the biologic niche left behind after the elimination of HPV types 16 and 18.”
Gardasil is supposed to prevent 70% of cases of cervical cancer, but it did not prevent 70% of cervical biopsies, colposcopies, and loop electro-excision procedures in vaccinated women. In Miller’s “Clinical Review of Biologics License Application for HPV 6, 11, 16, 18…”fda.gov/cber/review/hpvmer060806r.pdf, p. 368, Table 285, the results showed a 14.9% reduction in colposcopies in vaccinated women as compared with placebos, 17.2% reduction in biopsies, and 28.2% reduction in LEEP procedures. It should have been 70%, but wasn’t, probably because other serotypes had moved in and caused the vaccinated women’s lesions.


..."So, I am proud to proclaim that I am ANTI-VACCINE. It is a label I wear proudly. It came through painful, heart-breaking, hard-earned knowledge, and years upon years of reading, researching, learning, and talking with and hearing from others.

If you have experienced and/or learned enough to be opposed to vaccines, I encourage you to proudly announce that glorious fact!"

I AM ANTI-VACCINE, too (in case ya'll haven't guessed that by now). I completely concur with Laura Hayes. I live with guilt every single day knowing that I was going against my own heart when I allowed that nurse to pop my kid with 7 different vaccines in one setting. We weren't even coerced into vaccinating him. It was MY decision!!! Our pediatric office was fine with allowing us to either not vaccinate at all, or to selectively vaccinate (we'd had a parent/physician conference before hiring this one).

As to how the hell to fight this pro-vaccine, pro big pharma onslaught - I keep saying it's all about boots on the ground to anyone that asks me, but that's such a hard thing to accomplish.

And excuse my French here, but dammit, where are all the physicians, nurses, and others in the medical community that KNOW about the dangers of Gardasil (and other vaccines), but are too AFRAID to speak out? WE NEED YOU GUYS TO COME FORWARD.

I don't think we sound like hysterical fools; I think the fact that there are SO MANY OF US who are articulate and are speaking out, is scaring the crud out of certain people...that's why they're pushing back SO hard.

I like that saying that Deborah Rubenfeld posted: "The truth is like a lion; you don't have to defend it. Let it loose; it will defend itself."

But God Almighty - this is all so frustrating.

Laura Hayes

I hope it won't be long before it is no longer considered bad or offensive to be labeled "anti-vaccine." I thank God that I know way more than I did 22 years ago when I started to have children. If only I knew then what I know now, I would have KNOWN to be anti-vaccine! My mother's instinct told me to be anti-vaccine the first time the pediatrician told me it was time for my newborn daughter's "shots." I responded, "Shots? For what? I have no idea what you are talking about? I don't want her to have any shots." If only I had stuck to my guns, and left that pediatrician's office that very minute, oh how differently things would have turned out for our family. Unfortunately, I let her convince me to go back to the waiting room to "think about it for 15 min." She also handed me a 1/2 slip of paper that had a short paragraph that said that "vaccines were very safe", with only 1 (or did it say "less than 1"?) in a million having an adverse reaction to them. Even with the 1 in a million stat (yeah, right!), I still didn't want any part of those shots for my precious, healthy, robust, newborn daughter. However, when she came back out, using her sweetest voice, saying, "Come on back. They're perfectly safe. You have nothing to worry about," I acquiesced. She never even said which vaccines my daughter would be receiving, I never received VISs for the vaccines she received that day, she didn't ask even one question about our family's medical history, she didn't mention any possible adverse reactions for me to be on the lookout for, and she did not give me a booklet about vaccines, including their risks, which by law, she was supposed to do at that time (1992). There was ZERO informed consent.

Sadly, that was the start of my accepting vaccines without questioning for not only my daughter, but for my 2 sons. It took until 1997 for me to get smart enough for me to STOP vaccinating, never to vaccinate again! I now know far too much about the false, unproven, and frankly, ridiculous theory behind vaccination, far too much about what's in vaccines, far too much about the complete and utter lack of appropriate safety and efficacy studies behind individual vaccines, not to mention the complete absence of studies behind the multitudinous ways the vaccine schedule is actually given, and far too much about the greed, corruption, and abuse of power behind vaccine mandates in our country to ever allow another vaccine to enter anyone in my family!

So, I am proud to proclaim that I am ANTI-VACCINE. It is a label I wear proudly. It came through painful, heart-breaking, hard-earned knowledge, and years upon years of reading, researching, learning, and talking with and hearing from others.

If you have experienced and/or learned enough to be opposed to vaccines, I encourage you to proudly announce that glorious fact!


Wow! Utah Southwest Dep't of Health did ban Gardasil. I had to actually look at your link to believe it, not an MD.


It looks like Katie Couric and co. are succumbing to what must be intense pressure from whoever pays the bills.

They now have a red "Must See" button, about half way down the right side of the page. Under that, it says, "HPV conversation continued."

Click on that, and it leads to a page where Katie waffles and says that they're going to invite a host of doctors, researchers, and journalists to "weigh in" so that people don't unduly panic about Gardasil.

You can bet they're going to invite people like Seth Mnookin and Paul Offit. With nobody else to provide balance.

Please share this with every doctor you know who has admitted the possibility of vaccine injuries. Please share it with every family you know who has won in vaccine court.

Because if Merck wins this one, what do you want to bet that Gardasil will become mandated for schools, for marriage certificates, for employment in health care industry, for drivers' licenses, you name it.

Merck and the vaccine industry is playing hardball. They have better equipment than we do, better-trained players, more money to pay or bribe for whatever the hell they want, and I am worried sick that we don't have what it takes to fight them.

The truth is not enough.

And the number of understandably irate parents who go on forums and scream that the shills are shills, and are evil, etc., are totally correct, but that gets us nowhere. All it does is make us all look like hysterical fools.

How the hell do we fight this?


"MALICA: I would encourage parents to do exactly as this mom did .. she did her own research .. she spoke to her pediatrician .. she spoke to family and friends .. and saw they had daughters who went through it and didn't have any adverse effects .. and .. I hope they will actually make the decision to vaccinate."

That - coming from a pediatrician, after hearing what Emily, Rosemary, Lauren, and the true HPV expert, Dr. Harper, said. Who would trust this profession after this unbelievable display of complete disregard for the recipients? She doesn't care what happens after administration, she just calls out "next". Could it be any clearer that her mission is not to protect children but to protect the vaccine?

She said people should speak to family and friends. Doesn't she realize that people speaking to family and friends is why she was asked to be on the show?

Not an MD

And then, there was Utah….


How's that for fabulous news? Utah's Southwest Department of Health has banned Gardasil.

beth johnson

Thanks, Bob, for allowing us to read this without having to watch people like Dr. Marshall. A true public service.

Deborah Rubenfeld

The rabid pro-vaxers appear to be in a huge state of panic over the information released by this one show! There can be no going back, the truth is now out. To continue with my lion quote motif (!)

“The truth is like a lion; you don’t have to defend it. Let it loose; it will defend itself.”- Augustine


Yes, you would think in the interest of safety for our children and just doing the right thing that we should be able to discuss this matter without needing to polarize it so much and be calling many of those people whose children had serious side effects 'anti- vaccine.'
I have vaccinated my children (albeit cautiously and avoiding certain ones due to benefit-risk analysis) but I certainly think many of the so called safety studies are biased and poorly done. It may be that this relatively new vaccine is showing some very real problems at this stage of mass roll-out (phase 3 clinical trial?). Obviously France, India and Japan have ecome concerned enough to halt it for the time being.

Blanche Heidengren

Thank you for sharing this...I am so thankful that Katie had the boldness to bring up the controversy surrounding the Gardisil vaccine. There have been too many young women injured by having adverse reactions to it, to not speak up and talk about it! May this be one more thing that will help people to wake up and educate themselves before they vaccinate themselves or their children!

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