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    « My Semester With an Asperger's Syndrome Student* | Main | Attend the Defeat Autism Now! Conference FREE! »

    August 21, 2008

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    The picture illustrating this article brings back memories of seeing this movie (Attack of the 50 Foot Woman) on TV as a young kid -- it gave me a nightmare!

    Sounds similar to the last impending epidemic of 1994, invented mathematically by a government that later failed to inform its rapid consenting public that less than 200 cases of measles had been prevented at the cost of 8 millions vaccinated with thousands of adverse reactions, hopsitalisations and chronic debilitation that are logged in the archives. That 'epidemic' turned out to be suspiciously coincident with the end of shelf life of vaccines pulled due to links with the meninigitis epidemic of 1992 that had been flagged to the JCVI government advisors years before it was pulled - could they care less about our kids? The answer is probably, after all have not Ukraine and Argentina recently puled MMR due to a large number of suspicious deaths after the vaccine was distributed - I do not remember any warning to parents, from our department of health about the deaths and suspension of MMR in those countries pending investigations, as part of the requirement for parents and children to be fully informed prior to expecting their consenting to what may be suspect MMR...

    Dear Ds Advocate - is the "D" your an advocate for Brian Deer by any chance?

    Took a moment to follow the link to epiwonk's blog. It's actually very interesting, especially this bit from his comments:

    Aug 9th, 2008 at 2:15 pm

    Hi, Epiwonk!
    Really enjoying your blog over here.

    Just a couple of other caveats to add.

    1)There’s also this fairly recent finding (which, of course, needs to be replicated before being taken too seriously)

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18086216?dopt=Abstract

    “There was a positive association between pertussis infection and atopic disorders in the pertussis vaccinated group
    only. From the present study, it cannot be concluded whether this association is causal or due to reverse causation.”

    Which might go along with this:
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TD4-4RTTJHD-3&_user=10&_coverDate=03%2F25%2F2008&_rdoc=3&_fmt=summary&_orig=browse&_srch=doc-info(%23toc%235188%232008%23999739985%23683006%23FLA%23display%23Volume)&_cdi=5188&_sort=d&_docanchor=&_ct=12&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=da944064c4c7121ed478361bef19aa8c

    “Summary
    The global expression of immune response genes in infants after vaccination and their role in asthma and allergy is
    not clearly understood. Pharmacogenomics is ideally suited to study the involved cellular responses, since the
    expression of thousands of genes can be assessed simultaneously. Here, array technology was used to assess the
    expression kinetics of immune response genes with association to asthma and allergy in peripheral blood mononuclear
    cells (PBMC) of five healthy infants after vaccination with Infanrix-Polio Hib. At 12 h after in vitro
    re-stimulation of the PBMC with pertussis toxin (PT) antigen, 14 immune response pathways, 33 allergy-related and
    66 asthma-related genes were found activated. ”

    2) aluminum adjuvants stimulate an IgE-heavy immune response, so you really need to look at asthma and allergy in
    a cohort who recieved all 4 aluminum adjuvanted vaccines and compare that to those who recieved none.

    Go down to page 114 here to read a bit about aluminum and the potential Th2/IgE “bias” created by that adjuvant:

    http://www.autismhelpforyou.com/AL%20-%201.pdf
    (WARNING: BIG PDF transcript of HHS workshop on aluminum in vaccines.)

    And epiwonk's response:
    "I hesitate to comment on your other observations, since I’d prefer to stick to epidemiology, which is my area of expertise."

    See? Epiwonk is a valuable member of this community! S/he just happens to be interested in meta-analysis rather than helping our kids or kids born in the future.

    As an aside, that HHS conference on aluminum in vaccines happened in May 2000. That was an election year, 8 years ago, right? And who's been in office since then? And what have they done about this, exactly, in those 8 years?

    Apologies to the moderators for length and breaking margins. I can get supplements into toddlers but I don't know how to squish URLs.

    But Suissa was wrong.

    Colmcq

    The only thing which is clear from this is that the Staten Serum Institut, Denmark and the New England Journal of Medicine don't wish to discuss it, or any criticims of their study.

    D's Advocate, you have several comments on this post alone. Do you need me to show you the others you've posted here over the weeks and months? Stop whining. We don't have to approve every comment from every commenter - nor do we. We have several people who moderate - and our tolerance levels vary. If you dislike Age of Autism and/or our practices, don't read us. Spend your time with your fellow doctors and pharma/biotech professionals at the scienceblogs. Capisca? Kim

    Does this mean you are going to stop referencing Suissa's letter in future discussions about Madsen now that you know his logic and conclusions were wrong?

    Of course, Epiwonk will not even put his real name to his criticisms. On the other hand we do find that the data separately obtained by Stott et al, and Goldman and Yazbak showed an increase in autism in the vaccinated group - as suggested in Cochrane's reading. Colmcq seems disinclined to dispute Cochrane. Meanwhile we are expected to swallow - presumably without comment - the ad hominem 'Why crank journals are unreliable' from Anthony Cox of UK medicines licensing authority yellow cards scheme(MHRA).

    You wonder on what basis you would get a 9% protective effect against autism with MMR unless there was an improper adjustment? And I remain puzzled, if Suissa, was simply wrong why NEJM did not allow debate. What is happening is that any discussion is being institutionally pushed to the margins - and then conducted on their side by shadowy surrogates like Epiwonk (apparently a retired CDC scientist).

    http://epiwonk.com/?page_id=2

    "Suissa is saying essentially the same thing as Cochrane, only Cochrane fails to mention in what way the errors would effect the result. Is Cochrane wrong too?"

    That was not my point, and as well you know it! Suissa is wrong - yet you keep quoting his erroneous letter. If you think epiwonks comments were unfair or flawed, please post your rejoinder.

    Returning to Colmcq's brittle claim - if Madsen et al and NEJM had been able to deal with Samy Suissa's criticisms it would have been greatly to their advantage to have the letter published. The obvious inference is that they could not.

    I used to live in the UK and unlike most parents on this forum my son was not vaccinated, but hair and blood test showed a very high elevated amount of Heavy Metals primarily Mercury and Aluminum !!! I could not understand how they got there and through my googling research I can now point the finger at Epidural ( mercury ) via his mother and Vitamin K ( aluminum ) which we where blackmailed into by the bad parents scare tactic if we didn't.

    The press are one thing in the UK but the National Health Service who having injected there poisons and diagnosed my son just a few years later basically suggested we locked him up and throw away the key.

    Well a big Thank you America and to the internet my son his now recovering very well ,we now live in Brazil where the rates of Autism are nothing like there are in the UK and the USA !!! most incidence are in the bigger industrial cites like Sao Paulo and even so the rates quoted are 1/2500 . I don't know to much about there vaccination program hopefully someone might one day soon be able to find out more .
    Again Thank You
    Shaun and Austin aged 7 and 11 months

    Awwww. This is a sad commentary. You will no longer post my questions or responses. How sad. It speaks volumes about this website and your cause.

    Funny, those scienceblog websites post all commentary and opinions, including several posters that post here regularly. What does that say of those sites ethics and their position, I wonder?

    I guess if you can't be right, do your darnedest to fool people into believing you.

    So sad.

    Well, atleast you, the editor was able to read this and can think about your attitudes toward public discourse and morality in the media, and perhaps you'll think abit about who you really are and where you stand on this issue.

    Really, really sad.

    Does anyone happen to know if there is any information on how many deaths there have been from the MMR vaccine within the past 10 years here in the US? Just a curiousity

    To those who would not like to agree with the parents of the autistic kids, I would say:
    I have watched the vaccine autism discussion in the US since 1998 and in India since about 2003. ( One more coincidence for the health authorities- The cases of autism increased in India after mmore doses of Hib and Hep B and Flu vaccine with mercury were added to the Indian schedule) One conclusion after all these years: Listen to the Parents of the Autistic Kids- They'll get it right. The doctors and public health people will not.It happens every time without fail. The parents say autism is increasing- The public health docs say no it is not. Research proves parents right. Parents say that the mercury in vaccines is too much. Public health docs say nonsense, until a senior immunologist admits the truth. It is far too much. Parents say that autism is not fully genetic. Once again they are right. Its amazing- all those dumb parents who now dont want to vaccinate their kids according to the schedule. They were right every time. Maybe they will be right in the future too! My money?- Its on the parents.

    WHOA! "I don't see a problem in the government intervening to save people (and their children) from parental stupidity."

    At the risk of feeding the trolls, frankly, I don't see the problem in the people (parents) intervening to save their children from governmental stupidity.

    Turning this argument into a "blame the parents" game is an old standby of Pharma shills everywhere. Equating parents not injecting potential toxins into their babies at the moment of birth with parents beating their children over the heads is a specious argument.

    Parents here did the vaccines; that's how they got here. Parents speaking out about how their children were injured by vaccines happens to be protected by the 1st Amendment. Parents who are deciding whether or not to vaccinate look around at their friends and neighbors and see the truth in growing and undeniable numbers -- the current vaccine schedule can be dangerous. If Pharma, FDA and CDC spent half the time making vaccines safer that they do defending the unacceptable but profitable status quo, they'd get a lot farther in the long run.

    Last I checked, we don't (mostly, lack of Congressional oversight notwithstanding)live in a Pharma-fascistic police state.

    Colmcq

    Suissa is saying essentially the same thing as Cochrane, only Cochrane fails to mention in what way the errors would effect the result. Is Cochrane wrong too?

    Tracey-- we are not crazy. Vaccines are not 100% safe for everyone, nor has it been anywhere close to having been proven that they do not cause autism (or have you forgotten Hannah Poling?). There are people who should not be vaccinated according to the recommended schedule if at all - those who are allergic to one or more ingredients of the vaccine, those who have had a vaccine reaction (or who have a family history of vaccine reaction) and those who have a family history of auto-immune disease are examples.

    I know myself that vaccines can cause harm. My brother caught a very bad case of the measles from the vaccine - not the MMR, the prior version of the vaccine. This was confirmed by his doctor. My mother was told by her doctor that she should not take the flu vaccine anymore; every time she took it she caught the flu, which then progressed to bronchitis and at least twice to pneumonia. My daughter has autism, which we believe was caused by her vaccinations and my 4 dental amalgams.

    By the way, I had mumps twice, and I had no real difficulty in getting pregnant. So much for your categorical statement that mumps cuases sterility.

    Also, your post strongly implied that you would like to have us all forcibly vaccinated. That is more in keeping with something a totalitarian state would do. I hope that you do not truly mean that.

    Carolyn M.

    "It's time to take off the tin foil hats, folks. When science repeatedly proves that vaccines don't cause autism, and some people disagree, I don't see a problem in the government intervening to save people (and their children) from parental stupidity."

    Really? Then why do so many scientists disagree. Why is it that Dr. Healy, Dr. Poling, Dr. Gordon and the host of other doctors who have stepped away from mainstream medicine and become DAN doctors are all saying that the science is wrong? Could it be because the science is wrong?

    Why is it that Hannah Poling developed autism after a vaccination? And how can you even remotely justify listening to organizations that knowingly and willingly poison people for profit and then try to cover it up (I'm not talking about vaccines here, I'm talking about Drug companies and Vioxx, Paxil, and too many others to even name in one post). Too bad there's no vaccine for gullibility, Tracey.

    Hey, I think I hear the rest of the sheeple calling you, Tracey. Hurry up and follow the rest of the herd. It's hard to really see what's going on when someone's but is in your face, Tracey.

    What sickens me about all of this is all of the air-time that this is getting. All over the news stations, they talk about how this is growing into the next major epidemic, that we're going to have bodies lining the streets from all of these measles deaths. 140 something cases out of 300 million Americans. MY GOD, WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE!!!

    But, they don't mention the fact that a growing number of children are having adverse reaction to the vaccines (insert Church of Immaculate Vaccination mantra here ("But vaccines SAVE LIVES!")). They don't mention that the reason why all of these parents are choosing not to vaccinate is because of the loss of trust with the medical community. Pharma is guilty guilty GUILTY of knowingly lying about the safety of their products, and they've been caught red handed more than once. And nothing is being done about it. So how is that the fault of the parents?

    Oh, about the media play on all major networks. Yes, I smell a coordinated attack. Let's scare all those crazy ant-vaxxers. Either that, or we'll make the public stone them in the streets. Muah hah hah

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